Erica: Tale of Two Men

Transcript

Welcome to the Pineapple Pinnacle Hot Wife Life podcast. On today's podcast, I have a hot wife, Erica, who has recently moved into a poly. Well, not really a poly. She's just got a boyfriend. And we talk about connection and how her relationship has developed. Sensing a theme. Hi, Erica. Welcome to the show. All right. So, as you know, as you know, recently I I have been really struggling with the question of connection and what it looks like. And you had you and I had spoken. We texted, emailed back and forth.

And you have a very interesting take on connection because of how your particular relationship has developed. So let's start with, first of all, let's start with your origin story. How did you get into the life? Yeah. So I was originally in the lifestyle about 20 years ago. I was actually using a fake ID to get into swingers clubs during my first go round in the lifestyle. And during that time, it was with my ex husband, and we only did like girl girl soft swap type of play. And, you know, I was 20 years old, we did it for like four or five years.

And I had literally no idea what I was doing other than I was attracted to women. And that's a whole other, that could be a whole other discussion. That's a whole other yes. So fast forward to about five or six years ago. And I, you know, by this point, my ex-husband and I had been together for quite a long time. Our sex life was just awful, but our relationship in general just was not very connected at all. And we had done couples counseling. We had tried all the things and we decided first I opened up.

I was like, I think maybe I need to date a woman within like kind of the bounds of our relationship. But I want it to be just separate. I don't want it to be like a swinging experience again. Yeah, he didn't need to really be involved in that relationship. No, no. And so I did start dating a woman. It was, again, that's another story. She was a family friend, didn't really end the best. But through that, I realized I was missing connection in my marriage and doing all the things to try to foster it. And we ultimately decided that we were going to go our separate ways.

In the midst of this, I actually started seeing another family friend and he, um, you know, I should have, you shot very close to home. I was, I was a local shopper. Um, a lot of lessons were learned and, um, he actually was the one that introduced me to hot wifing. And his ex-wife, he and his ex-wife had been the lifestyle as she had been a hot wife. And I had never heard of it prior to him.

And I was, you know, 30, 36, 37, kind of ready to break out of my sexual shell, like definitely getting more comfortable with my body, more comfortable with my sexuality, and just wanting to try different things. Because I've been, you know, with my ex-husband since I was 20 years old. So it was very, you know, I hadn't had that like, yeah, I hadn't had that exploration period. I think that's what I was truly looking for.

Like I want a connection, but I also wanted to explore and I thought I could do it, you know, in some kind of like hybrid poly thing within my marriage, but it's just like the foundation just wasn't there for that.

So fast forward, I'm dating this guy and he introduces me to hot wifing and he was like, I want set you up with random people before you go too far let's talk about what hot wifing definition was for you guys because right I I've come to learn that it means a lot of different things to a lot of different people so what did it mean for you guys so for him he wanted me to just fuck other guys and then we talked about it while having sex. Now we weren't in a committed relationship or anything like that.

We were both just kind of like skirting out of our marriages and like, you know, found comfort in each other, but it wasn't any kind of like serious long term relationship relationship or anything so he wanted me to fuck his friends anonymously like he wanted to set me up and just have a friend come in like fuck and leave I'm like okay he want to watch did not want to watch he wanted videos, but that was pretty much the extent of his involvement. And then when we would get back together, then as he was fucking me, he would want to hear what happened. The details. Yeah.

So we did it with one friend and it was pretty middle of the road.

It wasn't that great, but I was super amped because of just doing something super naughty because i had never really done anything like that before and the sex that the guy and i had afterwards like the the reconnect or i don't even know that it was that it was just very fueled by that sexual experience so he wanted me to fuck his second friend and i said okay and he was like this guy he has a bigger cock he's you know like super good looking he really knows how to please a woman so okay it's interesting that he would know that but go ahead yeah so in walks my current husband.

And when we met, it was a blind hot wifing date. We had spoken via text for a couple days before we met. And it was like a wildfire. When we kissed for the first time, my whole world just totally stopped. And we had the best sex of my life. We did. It was just so amazing on every level. And I knew, I was like, I could never go back to not knowing this man after that experience. So he was in the middle of kind of getting out of a long term girlfriend relationship that wasn't working, but was lingering. And I was getting out of the marriage and everything at this point still.

So we saw each other casually for about like six months. And I shared with him, I was like, I'm in love with you. I love you. I mean, we had many conversations, but our relationship has always been open. It started at that point of, you know, meeting as a hookup and has kind of gone from there, which is a very non-traditional route, but it has worked for us. Exactly. And can I just lay this out right now? That is acceptable.

If the relationship that you're building is always like, it starts as something and it has continued to be that thing, as long as it working for you applause applause because that means you guys knew from the beginning what it is that you were looking for what it was that you wanted and you wanted something that wasn't quote unquote normal but it works for you guys it keeps you guys connected in a way. And I think, you know, I put myself out there on different podcasts and on FetLife.

And I think that people could take an assumption that we're all about lifestyle and things like that when really, that's a part of it. Like if we have time, we will definitely enjoy that aspect of our life but we have built an entirely normal life I mean he's currently out at Lowe's getting a new lawnmower because he wants a push mower in addition to our ride-on mower so you know it's just we are just regular people that happy to happen also be very kinky people. Yeah. And I love that.

I love that because he's probably running into my husband at Lowe's right now because my husband is also going to Lowe's to get something. Not that this is sponsored by Lowe's, but whatever. So the thing is, I applaud that point because that is very understandable because in every lifestyle marriage, the main thing is, is there's still a freaking marriage and whether or not you are fucking 12 guys last night or not, you still have to pay the gas bill and do the dishes and it's got to all get done. So that's awesome that you guys have found that relationship that works for you guys.

But how often would you say that you do play in the lifestyle? Um, I would say, um, prior to meeting my boyfriend that we're going to talk about, um, it was maybe like once a month or once every couple months. Again, it just was very dependent on schedules and kids sports and all of the other minutiae that we have to deal with. So, you know, we got it in where it fit in. But we're never people that like we don't post like hot dates or anything like that.

It's just, if we have the time and we go to a party or we make a connection with someone, we'll pursue it, but we're not actively looking for it. Gotcha. Okay. So now let's get into, since you brought it up, let's get into connection. Let's get into what brought you to your current relationship status. Yeah. So I will say from the very beginning with my husband, we were open to exploring a bunch of different dynamics. And one of them that we discovered early on was that he very much enjoyed seeing me with another man.

We had gone to a swingers club a couple times and um had like kind of dabbled with couples and another single woman and we kept coming back to the fact that like our hottest experiences were with another man in the bedroom and we did are you talking MMF or are you talking, um, MF? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So MFM and then, but it's definitely both of them having their way with you, not one watching. Okay. Yes. I mean, we, we kind of did both. Um, he loved to watch and film and then join in or just joining in from the beginning. So it was kind of a mix of experiences.

And we found it's pretty simple to find a single guy that's willing to fuck me, just in plain words.

And but yeah, you know, there's a plenty there's dick coming in from everywhere um if you're on tinder they're just slapping you in the face yeah it's like that hot dog meme um gif thing but at the end of the day i was having really great sex with my husband and so i'm like oh we keep hunting these guys and it's like in and out in and out like it's just it was okay and in and of itself it was a hot experience but after you do that several times you can't it kind of loses its luster yeah it just becomes transactional and then something very a little bit mundane a little bit like normal. Yes.

Yeah. Like, okay, this is power. So we began kind of the search for connection. And when we first began, it was pretty standard of what you hear from a lot of lifestyle couples. It's like, well, you want that connection, but you don't want it too much. Like, how are you going to set those boundaries of like, we going to group text are we going to always play together I mean I was just listening to your episode from last week and you spoke or you had a question from a listener and they were saying that they didn't want to get too attached to anyone well I mean that a very vague statement.

What is too attached? Like, are they calling you when they have a flat tire? Or are they calling you when they have, like, an empty bed and want you to join them? Like, there's a broad range of too attached. So we kind of started just seeking out connection. But, you know, as it is in the dating world, you can't just say, oh, I want connection, snap your fingers, and it's going to be right there. Right. We found a guy. And I saw him for a few months. But he's very, very popular within the hot wifing community locally here.

And I really wanted somebody who was more like, singularly focused on me and also would put in the effort outside of the bedroom. There was an instance where we were both kind of in the same area. And I had about an hour of downtime. And I said, Hey, I'm at such and such a place. Would you like to join me for a drink?

And I said, I have an hour before I have to go do something you know with work or my kids or something and he was like oh well if you could play that would be one thing and I was like what and at this point we had been fucking for like a couple months we had you know done a decent amount of hanging out so that was very honestly hurtful yeah let's take it let's take it one step further if this was vanilla that would be a major red flag huge red flag a major red flag so if you are looking for something that is connected if you think about it in terms of how would this play in a vanilla role your red flags are your red flags so right okay so needless to say that was the last um interaction I really had with him I did um I didn't ghost him I did say hey I don't think like you know what we're looking for is aligning at this point and I did let him know that I found that to be very hurtful.

And, you know, obviously, he has every right to not want to join me for a drink. But just the fact that, you know, he wanted sex to be attached to any sort of effort when it came to me, I was like, that's just not the energy that I want in my life. So that's applaudable, because you didn't yuck yum. You didn't say I, it's not cool that you want that. What you said was that's not what I'm looking for. Right. I applaud you for good going out and getting what you're looking for, but that's not, it's not aligning with what I'm looking for currently. So that's great. That's perfect.

Well, I am a therapist actually. And so I do try to be intentional with my communication with people. And with, you know, partners and other people that I come in contact with, I do just try to just genuinely treat people with respect. So that was probably maybe two, two and a half years ago. And then, you know, life happened. And we had a couple of regular bulls that they did, they got the job done, you know, and safe. We all got along well.

We had one that I actually had one of my first like solo experiences with because I finally, it took me a few years, I would say maybe three years to be comfortable doing a solo experience. And so we had a lot of good times in that time, like from two and a half years to now, but it was definitely a building period.

So I was at the point last winter that I'm like, I just don't want anything anything transactional I do want to find a partner that's going to be a little bit more stable that I can kind of build something with but we didn't know that um where he was going to come from obviously and because if you knew that you'd be you'd be like I would have a genius guru exactly um so funny enough I actually had listened to a podcast and there was a woman on there she was very empowered she had a lot of different things irons in the fire she actually would enjoy going on a sugar daddy website and finding men that way which is basically as transactional as it comes but I just thought the thing was like Thank you.

site and finding men that way which is basically as transactional as it comes but I just thought the thing was like the premise was hot um I would start talking to my husband about it and and he um he thought it was really hot too so I went on the website right around Christmas time because I had some time and I met a guy and it was extremely transactional but but fun and we had a great time and that kind of uh fueled the fire and then the next guy that i met was actually my current boyfriend so we matched and quickly um moved off the site onto an app to chat.

And the conversation right from the beginning was very natural. He's very intelligent. He's successful. And kind of our play styles really aligned well. Unbeknownst to me, he had been following me on FetLife for several years. It's always nice to meet a fan. Yeah. He was like, I, when I saw your pictures, I was like, there's no way this girl is on the site. So we met up one evening, had a great night and he was very interested in talking and just like connecting.

And left and i called my husband right away and i was like you know i just don't get it like this guy was like talking about his mom and like work and all these different things like he just really wanted to just like talk to me and be with me and my husband's like well i mean you got the money either way, you know, so it doesn't really matter. And, um, so we, we continue to just text a lot. And I thought about him a lot. And over the next few weeks, like we just kept meeting up and everything was going really well.

And so finally, like during one of our meetups, I was like, you know, I'm actually a hot wife. And my husband would love to see like some pictures or videos from our time together. And he was really down with it. You know, we had kind of shared some previous experiences, and he had been a third for a couple for like two years prior to meeting me and so we started you know incorporating the pictures and videos in our play and then a few weeks goes by and we ended up having a threesome with my husband and the rest has just kind of been history. They hit it off right from the start.

And, um, I've been, you know, dating this man, his name is Alex for almost nine months now. Wow. Okay. So I just, I just have to ask. Yes. My, I have a husband and I love my husband, but man, on my end, they're a lot of work. So how is it to have a husband and a boyfriend? I mean, if I'm having, if I have bowls over, it's very transactional.

I don't't like there's not a lot of effort put in i mean there's a lot of vagina put in but not you know right yeah um i will say it's it waxes and wanes as far as um you know our schedules um as far like communication frequency but i do see it as what it's like having multiple children like is it extra effort absolutely like are there times like even right now I've been kind of toying around with like maybe getting like a boy toy or something like I would love to find like a 24 25 year old guy and train him on a cubby yeah yes yeah and um so um since I do have like you know that relationship with both of them I'm not just communicating that desire with one I I want to have the transparency with both so yeah it's a lot of work.

But it's also very rewarding. I'm having really connected experiences with this man. And I have very little free time. I have very little time to devote to playing outside of the home because I do have multiple children and I'm very busy. And so to me, he's worth my energy and the relationship that we've built is worth my energy. And I know like, like he's making me a better person. Right. And I think that's important. I think it's important that you recognize where the effort is worthwhile because with this guy, it's worthwhile. Right.

Whereas with the guy who just wouldn't even meet up with you, that energy output was not worthwhile. So I applaud the fact that you're actually taking inventory and saying, this is what my time is. And it is a precious commodity. How do I want to spend it? And I do love the fact that you are looking for a cubby. I mean, I think that's freaking phenomenal because we need to teach them. We need to tell them what's good and what's bad. So it's, it's our duty to womanhood. Honestly. I mean, eventually they're going to get married and their wives will thank us. Exactly.

They might not know who to fake, but they will thank the woman that has gone before them. Exactly. Okay. So talk to me about, um, what connection means to you. I mean, because I'm still, I'm going to be frank. I'm still a little vague about it because I know what it is with my husband. Right. And, but I don't know outside of that if I'm building connection or if I'm just making friends, you know what I mean? Well, and I think connection transcends romantic love.

I mean, if you are having a close relationship with a coworker that has nothing to do with like any sort of, there's no erotic component there, but you are sharing yourself with that co-worker if you have a good friend you're sharing yourself with that friend and so to me it's about that mutual sharing of um of yourself like what makes you tick what are your prior experiences um how is your day something as fundamental as like truly caring about how a meeting went or how, you know, your workout was, that's building connection.

And I think that you can have that type of connection with unlimited people. It just is all about the balance that you have in your life. Like if you're not, if you're failing at one area, because you're leaving every day for two hours to go fuck a guy, you know, transactionally, you're failing like your true connections, even though you're not like having a connection with someone else. Like, yes, that, that emotional energy is a commodity, but I think as long as you know how to balance, sometimes, you know, people in your life, it's always a balancing act, right?

Like there's going to be some days where your husband has a truly awful day and you're going to need to be there to support him in a more profound way than you typically would. Now, if you have a best friend and they have a bad day, like that person's going to get more of your emotional energy. So it's all about sharing yourself in a way that is respectful to the people that you care about. And you're showing up in a way that is like kind and genuine for those around you. Right. It's something that matters. Right. Yeah. Okay.

So in your current husband-boyfriend scenario, do you have any rules in place? Honesty. That's a good one. Yeah. I mean, there's no, there aren't any day-to-day rules. I would say it sounds very simple to say like, oh, I have a boyfriend, but I will tell you there have been hours of conversations between my husband and I. We also work with a couple's therapist every two weeks who is kink aware and very friendly to all relationship types. She's helped us navigate some of these.

We've had conversations, the three of us had conversations between myself and alex it's been a lot of talking a lot and it's not something that we just aim upon um flippantly so there are no hard and fast rules other than sexual safety obviously um i don't use condoms with either of them. So we are like open and honest and transparent when it comes to sexual partners. And other than that, it's just treat each other respectfully. I mean, it's very simple when it comes to the rules.

Yeah, because I mean, simplicity is best when it comes to these rules, because the thing is, is that when you get more complicated and you're like every third Wednesday, you're allowed to, it makes it so that the rules are too hard to follow and therefore they get forgotten. So transparency being your steadfast, hard and fast rule, that's a good, that's a good place to begin. And it also helps to keep the bad feelings at bay because you are sharing that transparently. You're, this is, this is what we're going through.

This is, and I, I applaud the fact that you found him on a sugar daddy website. That's, that to me is intensely interesting. It's very interesting. Yes. But so your relationship developed, is it still that sugar daddy, sugar baby kind of feel or is it more vanilla than that? that yeah so we have discontinued that aspect of our relationship um through a conversation um I wanted him to feel very secure with me or I wanted to just provide an environment that he felt secure.

And through conversations, it seemed like the financial aspect of it was no longer appropriate for the level of feelings that we had. So I totally respect that. Now, if he wanted to pay for my nails or something like that, I'd be all for it. Right. But, um, but yeah, so I think it has evolved over time as, as there's a difference between boyfriend pampering and sugar daddy. Very different. But the thing is, is that my husband still pampers me. I mean, right. And they look great. Thank you. Sorry for the listener. I just showed her my nails. Yes.

Um, but so, I's an important I think it's important to have those moments that make you feel special even if it's be even if you started out sugar daddy sugar baby he still needs to put in that kind of effort, right? Just as you put in the emotionally pampering effort that you do. Um, I think that that is not just because a relationship starts somewhere doesn't mean that that's where it ends up. And since it has evolved outside of that sugar daddy, sugar baby situation, that's, that's nice to know that that aspect of it kind of was put away. And now it was right. Yeah. Yeah.

And I definitely think that that aspect of our relationship ran its course, and I'm thankful for it. And, you know, you meet people when you're supposed to meet them. Exactly. And I think that for us, we're in the right headspace, emotional space, that it was the right time. And I just really give a lot of credit to my husband because he is the most secure person you will ever meet. And we have really just uhed this together and dissected this together. And he's like, look, we're going to make it through anything. And that's the kind of security that I need.

Because even though it like to the listeners out there that aren't in this situation, it might seem like I have my cake and I'm eating it too, which what the fuck else are you supposed to do with cake? Yeah, I know. Is it decorative? Right. So I am eating a decent amount of cake. However, like I'm also in a vulnerable position because I'm very deeply and intimately sharing myself with two men. And even though I have the security with my husband, I have the fear of fucking everything up. Hey y'all, I just wanted to take a second to remind you to head on over to privateadventures.net.

They have constantly changing inventory and constantly evolving Thank you. Thank on over to privateadventures.net. They have constantly changing inventory and constantly evolving blogs that may be of interest to you. And if you use the code pineapple pinup 10 to let them know that I sent you, I would, you would be supporting the show. Thank you. Can I ask a strange question? Yes. Where do you sleep every night? With my husband. So my boyfriend is in an open marriage as well.

So he has his wife and family and everything, which is good because I think it does help to um balance the scales balance the scales yeah yeah because it's it's very hard to be somebody's second when they are your first right it puts a very uneven tension on on that relationship so i mean I mean, again, like you said, you meet people for a season, for a reason, for whatever, like there's a, as long as you're meeting them at a place where you guys can be in that relationship and have it be something that is not diametrically, like, bad for one person. Right. Right.

and have it be something that is not diametrically like bad for one person, right? Because there are times when people try to force things, right?

When they try to do like, you're my everything and you're my side piece, you know, it makes it a little bit more like, as long as you guys are on the same emotional footing good on you I mean congratulations well I mean it's it's every day is a work in progress and I always just try to respect and honor whoever I'm with and I hope that they both feel that and I hope that you know my energy in their lives I mean I know for my husband I've seen the growth that we've had together like individually and as a couple over the last four years and I hope that I am a positive influence in any partner that I have because I just want to I just genuinely it sounds so hokey like, I want to be like that camp slogan, like leave it better than you found it.

And that's how I try to approach any type of relationship that I have with people. Okay. I've got another very weird question for you. Okay. Have you hit any potholes? Have you hit any, have you hit anything that was like, yeah, I mean, there's several things. Like the first thing that comes to mind is I don't like to share. So I don't like to share my husband. I don't like to share my boyfriend. I mean, I'm fine with his wife, obviously. And he's fine with, he also doesn't like to share me.

So whenever I broach this cubby situation, my husband's like, absolutely, whatever you want to do, I'm down for that. Whereas my boyfriend is like, oh, it's like the devil and the angel on my shoulder. So that's tricky because I want to be true to myself, be true to my marriage, but then also not like shit on another person. So that's a pothole.

I mean, I would say coming to terms with having like romantic love feelings for another person outside of my marriage, another pothole, because I wasn't anticipating that whenever I was looking for connection, connection and falling in love are two completely different things or can be completely different things. Um, and so that was a lot of soul searching. Um, when that, I started feeling that like maybe four or five months ago and I was really upset with myself. Like, how could I let myself get to this point?

I wanted, I noticed that you're bringing a lot of that onto yourself because of the fact that it wasn't anticipated and obviously not something that you necessarily want. But you definitely don't want to hurt your husband. Right. So, yeah, no, I understand that. I've built a whole life with him. I have, like, we've integrated our families. We have, you know, just integrated our souls together.

like we've integrated our families we have um you know just integrated our souls together like we have such a deep deep intimacy that I could have only dreamed of prior to this relationship because my ex-husband and I were like two ships passing in the night on parallel lives like not really ever sharing like like, intimate things, like, what are your hopes and dreams?

I mean, it sounds so corny, but like, every night, like, my husband and I are in bed, usually naked, and just talking about our day, talking about what we're looking forward to talking about, like, what worked well, what didn't work well, what we could do better, and just having those very like connected through yeah conversations and so the thought of a feeling for another person potentially like jeopardizing this massive thing that I've worked that we have worked so hard to build. It's like absolutely fucking terrifying. Oh yeah. No. Cause you're on the Titanic. You have built this thing.

It is going, it is holding your whole life up. And here comes a light, here comes an iceberg. And what do you do? Right. What do you do? So I tell my husband literally everything.

I'm like, oh my God, like, i have these feelings for him like i have fucked up like what you know i'm gonna end things with him um next time i see him i'm just gonna be like straight up like hey you know i really appreciate you but you know i'm getting in too deep we gotta there's that too deep that keeps coming back up but we gotta like cut and run and um and I was like oh you've been falling in love with him for quite a while now like this is not like this isn't new this is not new oh like okay he's like yeah I've seen it you know like you get giddy when you talk about him and he's like I like it like he's like, he's like, you're having, you know, he's all about like pictures, videos.

So I'll have him. I'll have my boyfriend over and we'll set up like security cam videos or security cameras. And he's like, you guys, like those videos are the hottest that you've ever done. He's like, I love seeing the passion between you guys.

I love the way way he treats you i love the way he communicates with you um and so he was basically like don't be a dumbass and fuck this up like he's telling me not to fucking up with the guy um but it's nice that he was looking out for because as long as he's not um injured by it and it's in it's enhancing your experience right where's the harm right where's the damage being done he would like more variety I mean if it were up to him I would be I would have my boyfriend and then I would probably have like a baseball roster of roster yeah but it's and and in my mind like it sounds super hot and maybe if i had more time but like in practicality it's just it's just not what i'm right up for in this season of my life because there is a certain amount of sleep that one needs.

You need sleep. My husband has a giant penis. And so I need like vaginal rest. Vaginal recoup. Exactly. So I always I am a size queen. So all of my partners are of decent size. So it is, you know, there's just like practical things that make a roster that would involve like multiple men on, you know, throughout the week. Just impossible. Maybe a basketball team. A basketball team is more doable than a baseball roster. Exactly. Exactly.

So and I think that now that i've found like the best outside of my primary relationship sex with somebody i'm like why would i want to like go again back to that like mediocre transactional experience like if we're at a play party i will 100 fuck like whoever whoever we love to go to parties that have glory holes I love like the glory hole um fun and like fucking guys through the glory hole sucking guys like that type of stuff is so fun for me and it really does fill my husband's like hot wiping kink cup when I do things like that.

But as far as like going out on dates and setting up play dates with a bunch of different guys, I'm just not in the headspace, emotional space for that right now. And I mean, with a family, with children, it's rough. I'm lucky. I'm lucky in the fact that I'm an empty nester now. Right. And that I have We'll be right back. it's rough. I'm lucky. I'm lucky in the fact that I'm an empty nester now and that I have oodles of time.

And so it, and here's the thing, your relationship may evolve again, and it may become something where your boyfriend does want to see you with another man or wants to share you more and, or that may meet its natural course, whatever, right. You can't tell where you're going to be in five years, but the, the nice, it's nice that you have some, uh, a husband who's open to emotional and physical intimacy that's deeper, that's beyond. Right. So, I mean, that's, that's freaking awesome.

So it's, it's made, um, our, it's made me like falling in love with another man has actually, and this sounds fucked up, but it's made me love my husband more because. Sweetie, you're talking, you're talking to somebody who completely gets that. I completely understand. I mean, not from an emotional standpoint, okay. Not from, because obviously, but the sheer amount of communication that is required to maintain a relationship when you're just in the lifestyle is going to create such a deeper connection because it is transparent. It's transparent from an aspect of fantasies.

It's transparent from an aspect of kinks. It's transparent from every deep, dark secret you could ever possibly have is going to come to light. And this is the person who you can give all of that vulnerable information to, and it is going to make things better between you.

And it has, it has made it exponentially better I feel so just lucky I feel so loved by my husband I feel so accepted by him um I truly feel yeah seen I mean we actually had a situation this past week where I have been wanting to be more open with him playing with other people, particularly couples, because he has had been a bull in the lifestyle for about like 10 years prior to us meeting. And so he really does enjoy that experience because it's something that you can't get. Like, he can't fulfill that within our relationship. And we've tried different things.

Like, we try to play time with a guy who is a cuck. But if you don't have that emotional connection to the person, like, you can't fabricate intimacy with somebody and like the hot wife dynamic works because of the love between the partners or stag fixin or however you want to label yourself you can't have that angst you can't have that jealousy for somebody you're not connected to right which makes complete sense So there's really no way to manufacture. Right. Yeah. You can't. We have tried. Right. Because I, I really don't like sharing him.

But I, I had an experience actually on my birthday and I was approached by a woman on FET, and she is a cuck queen. And she really wanted her husband to fuck me. Like, we did this whole setup. It was a very hot situation, actually. And through that experience, I really saw the joy that she had as a cuck for her husband having this very fulfilling experience with me. So it gave me a new perspective on my husband as a bull. And then we went to a play party and actually it was with both my guys.

And I set up a consensually, of course, I set up a situation where I picked out a woman who I thought was beautiful.

And I approached her, we talked and I said, Hey said hey like I would really love to see my guys with you and she was very down and it was like top of the mountain for me to see both of them and there was one point where my husband was fingering this woman and she was just like squirting and coming and it was like she was in total pleasure and like looking at her face and my husband and like I was getting fucked by my boyfriend at the time it was like just a very hot scenario but I was like seeing my husband provide that pleasure to someone else I was super into it and I've actually thought about it like multiple times And you you could feel what she was feeling.

I could. Yeah. And it increased your hotness because you could see it being played out visually as well as understand what it was going on physiologically. Right. So all of those two experiences really led me to saying to my husband, like, hey, why don't we explore you playing with couples again? Because we had put it on hold. It was something that we had tried to work through in therapy and in conversations and all these things multiple times. And finally, we were just like, let's just put it on ice because we can't get, like, we're not at the point to get past it.

so he has been with a couple of two times this past month or six weeks and I have had a hard time with it but I also like just reread the ethical slut and I am working on processing through like his experience of me being with someone else is different than my experience with him being with someone else. And just because I have like a negative reaction doesn't mean that he's doing anything wrong and, and all the things. So this past week, I took a different strategy and I have done, um, a lot of work. Um, I did a lot of hypnotherapy during my divorce.

Um, and I can just kind of turn off feelings just through like mindfulness practice. And so I'm like, you know, I'm just going to detach myself from the situation. He's going to go do his thing. I'm going to go do my thing. And, you know, my boyfriend and I went out to dinner. We, and well, he came to pick me up. We fucked in the living room. We went out to dinner. Then, you know, then we came back, we got a hotel room and fuck some more. And my husband was out with this couple. And I said to my boyfriend, I'm like, I feel like I'm cheating.

Cause I'm feeling so detached from my husband because it was like, let's just try this method of us kind of doing our own thing. And so all that to say, I think that it's not a linear process with evolution of relationships. And there are a lot of complex feelings that go into these like very hot scenarios. And I actually found that because before we had kind of had like a no sharing of details when it came to his play with others, I was really upset about how everything went down that evening just with my own emotional state.

And then through conversation, I actually found out I did want to see pictures and videos. And once I saw him in that role, like, pleasuring this woman and, like, giving this couple, like, the experience that they really longed for, I, like, fucked him like it was a reclaim. It was so hot. So, all that to say, like, just because you think, like, you're not into something or something's not for you, you have to kind of like play around with it. You can't say like, oh, I tried a restaurant. I didn't like it. You're not going to say like, I'm never going to go out to eat again. Right.

It just you've got to try different things. Yeah. And I mean, the thing is, is that the process of consent from within is evolving because you, when you're in this lifestyle, you're, you've got a, an open mind to multiple facets of how people are and who they are. So when you have that open mind. it can lead you to places that don't feel comfortable. But that's discomfort is not necessarily non-consent. Correct. Right. Discomfort is something where sometimes you have to sit in the question to find the answer.

And I love the fact that I was actually going to suggest that maybe he could write it down. And if you read it so that it wasn't coming from him, so you could kind of detach from it a little bit and find the heat within it, maybe that would help too. But the fact that you went back and looked at pictures and videos and that worked for you is good too. It worked out really well. Yeah. Because I mean, there was a time when that's how I was delivering it to my husband. I was delivering it through writing it down.

Even though my husband's been with me a lot, he doesn't necessarily know what it is that I'm going through unless I tell him. Right. Because like, I'll, I'm going to do a podcast about it, but I went to a party last night and it was so disappointing. And it was something that I was getting, there was a lot of hype given. And for some reason, I just thought it was going to work differently than it did. And it just never got to the point where it worked. And I was like, you know what? I don't think that's on us. I don't think that's on them.

I don't think that, I just don't think that this worked. Right. And so my, but my husband and I re really talked about it because for a while there, I was like, Oh God, is it me? Am I doing something? And my husband's like, I don't think it's you. Right. Right. I mean, I don't know the circumstance, but I've, I've listened to your podcast enough that you've had some very successful parties. yes yes that. I'm really good. I can tell from my own point of view that I'm really, really good with hotel parties, house parties. I fumble a little bit. Okay.

And it's because there's no clear starting gun. There's no, we're going to read the rules and then everybody go to it. Right. And so when it's something where I have to sit around and wait for people to find the chemistry and the connection. I know. It's, oh, it's so hard. You know, we're actually like Legos. If you put your end in my end, everything will work.

I struggle in in that environment as well which is why I love the glory hole aspects of the parties that we go to because I'm not great at small talk and my husband yeah my husband looks like an assassin and so like there's we are very friendly, people will not approach because I yeah so it is super awkward and like I you you have that like fear of rejection but it's not even rejection because I get it like not everybody's going to be down for me but it's just that, like, awkwardness of, I know I'm at a sex party.

But like, is this person here for a sex party to like, if I was this person just invited out and thought, Oh, hey, I'll go have some tea. Yeah, so it's just it is hard. And you know, there's no manual for how you're supposed to just show up somewhere and, like, share the most intimate parts of yourself with a random person. But I get it. I've never been to a hotel party where it is like, oh, now's the start. But I just I love the glory hole aspect because it just takes the guessing game out of it. Like, oh, a hard dick just came through the hole. Okay. I know what to do with that.

I've been studying the manual. Exactly. And if I really like that dick, sometimes I'll just be like, hey, do you want to go to a room? Hey, let's pop around the corner and see what's actually happening. Exactly.

But it takes that vulnerability out of it and I guess when you um like the house party that I referenced before since I had this specific fantasy I felt more empowered to just talk to this woman and like kind of get get my wishes out there but um typically it's nice to have an agenda it is nice yeah typically we just enter it like oh whatever happens happens and yeah but it's nice to know what you would like to have happen and then make a game plan to get it done to get it done right I think that's part of the thing that I did not show up to swap recipes I didn't show up to buy Tupperware.

That's not what I'm here for. So for me, exactly. So if you're not throwing dick my way, then what are we doing? I'm sure you're lovely. However, do you have a big penis? And if so, can I see it, please? And if I see it, can I then touch it and play with it? Okay. Yeah, no, believe me.

It's, it's one of those things that I, because of the fact that I struggle with the mental aspect of going to a house party, I struggle with the mental aspect of let's go make small talk with a bunch of people that we've never really, and we're probably never, and maybe we, and like it's, it's for me, it's rough to put myself in a position where I have to try to navigate the, the, like even more socially awkward situations.

Yes I know and I am so awkward like you know if I'm wearing heels or whatever with the outfit then I'm like oh I don't really want to stand around for an hour because my feet are gonna hurt but then if I sit down then I seem like more unfriendly you know like so I'm kind of like leaning on the furniture, like, Jesus Christ. It's weird. Yeah. That's another great thing about a hotel party. You just go strip down, take everything off, stick it in a closet. We're good. I feel like that would be better.

Although I will say, so we went to trapeze in Fort Lauderdale a few years ago and they have these playrooms where you have to be naked but they're totally separate from like the club area so we went you can't wear clothes or anything back there so you have to check all your clothes at the at the locker then you're just walking around back there naked and it's like uh are we like scoping people out to fuck like I did not I didn't like that environment like I feel like if I were going to be an environment where I need to get naked I would need to have like some kind of like pre-planned agenda going in yeah I mean the nice thing is is that when I go to a hotel party and he says, okay, so don't, no photography, always wear a condom.

Right. And now you may fuck. It's like, okay, now I know that I may fuck and I am going to go get that to happen. So I will go lay naked upon the bed. And that usually attracts, I mean, like you get a lot of flies with honey, but you can get a lot of cock with just being naked. Just being naked. Okay. So I'm going to maybe try that technique next time. I'll just get naked and be like, here, here we are. This is what we're doing now. But no, I mean, the thing is, is that it's, it's hard because you're not just dealing with yourself and your husband.

You're dealing with a lot of personalities and you're dealing with a lot of emotional baggage and you're dealing with a lot of people who have their own things going on in their vanilla lives.

So, I mean, it makes a, it makes a thing thing it makes a thing a thing so well it is and it is a very complex social situation it's a very vulnerable situation and you can never really predict how everything is going to go down and you just have to be open-minded and it's kind of back to that restaurant analogy if you go to one party and you're like it wasn't for me either like you don't go back to that party or you just try it a different night and see see what the energy is different yeah and I found that I guess I do prefer parties over lifestyle clubs because I found lifestyle clubs to be like very like weirdly cliquish um yeah I mean and I'm just not about that right I'm just like not about that I don't I mean I'm a grown-up I don't I'm there to meet new people so why do you kind of have that attitude I'm not sure but I mean it's all trial trial and error and for some people that's going to work really well and for others others, it's not right.

But it's good to know what works for you and your, your relationship. It's definitely, definitely. And it's also good to experiment outside of what you would, what has worked. Right.

So whenever you're at the hotel party with your husband, like what role does he typically play he just watches he watches and protects me from you know overly aggressive and he he's on more than one occasion been like yo dude you know step back right because there have been times when it is like you if you're the only person playing at a, at a hotel party, you're going to find that it's standing room only around the bed. And then it's like, wait a second. Right. Like just some space, please. So my husband is very much about making sure that I'm comfortable and that I am getting water.

And like he tends to play a really valet role for me. Right. Right. Making sure that I have clean towels and making sure that my robe is available and making sure like he just likes to take care of me in that situation. And I love the fact that he wants to pamper me and he wants to take care of me and he wants to protect me. That to me is a love language that I can really appreciate because a lot of times you do feel like a side of meat on, in those, in those situations.

So the fact that there's somebody there who's like really concerned about your wellbeing, checking in with you, making sure you're good and that you're not just a whole. Right. Yeah. And I found, so I would definitely be open to my husband playing at parties in certain circumstances.

Like I said before, but we've found he actually has more performance issues at parties which he never has at home because he is so focused on like making sure that everything is the same as your husband like I have everything I need everybody's like wearing a condom they're you know following the rules um being respectful so I think it is a complex thing. Like if, if you're not there to just like swap and get your rocks off with different people, which neither of us are in that situation, I think it's a, it's a unique role for husbands in a play party.

Um, you know, especially if they're more, um, you know, if, if your dynamic is more on the hot wife side. Absolutely. The thing is, is that there are parties, but there are definitely parties where I am, me and my husband's relationship is not welcome. If we are not full swapping. Okay. They don't want us there. Okay. So there's a difference between a fuck party and a swinger party. Swinger party. Right. And I personally, my thing is, is that I do consider myself part of the swinger community. I do consider myself to be someone who is in that lifestyle.

But a lot of times because of the fact that my husband doesn't play because I mean, there's a lot of reasons why he doesn't. And if he wanted to, I would be fully on board with it because for me, I'm like, you're giving me the same gift. You're giving me that gift. I'm okay with you doing that. And if I have a, if I have a problem, I'm going to let you know what my problem is and where it came from, and then we can discuss it. But because, but it's not something that I really have to test because my husband doesn't play. Right. He doesn't play for, like I said, a bevy of reasons.

Some of them health, some of them just, he just loves his role as having a live-in porn star. Right. I mean, honestly, I was just listening to a psychologist on a podcast and 55% of men in heterosexual relationships have fantasized about their women being with other men. So our guys are not in the minority, right? They're not fringe. They're just actually living out that fantasy that the majority of men have. And you know why that is? Women are notoriously hard to please. Women are notoriously, they're like, we're not easy. We're not, we're not a puzzle you can solve.

Every single one of us is different. So for men, they're judged on how well they satisfy a woman. So watching another man satisfy that woman and knowing that you are part of it in some way is extremely, so it's, it's a, it's a catch 22, right? Because they want to be really good at it, but they get off on watching other people do it better. I will say I've never had anyone do it better, but I will say that my husband's a very visible, visually stimulated person.

And so for me to be getting fucked, like either in front of him or on camera, I mean, he likes porn, you know, not to like a, an unhealthy degree, but he's like, I would rather watch you get fucked than like some person I don't know, you know, by far far and I also think it centers them like as a woman and as a mother as a professional like we're pulled in so many different ways but this like centers us back to our sexuality and our like position as a very sexual being and that like there's a lot of times where our husbands don't get to see us in that role because we have so Thank you.

a very sexual being and that like there's a lot of times where our husbands don't get to see us in that role because we have so many other hats that we wear we're too busy folding the underwear yes right and so when you when i'm like in lingerie getting the shit fucked out of me on camera like i am just that sexy woman that he initially fell for exactly yeah Thank you.

on camera like I am just that sexy woman that he initially fell for exactly yeah and and all of that pleasure is something that they feel good about this is somebody that they truly love and to see somebody you truly love be in like in such ecstasy has to be rewarding yes definitely I definitely. I cannot thank you enough for your time. Seriously, though. Of course. I hope that you and whoever listens to it, you know, gain some value out of it. But obviously, like this is only my experience. It's and every experience. But see, that's the best part. It's going to be different.

Every experience is going to be different. But if you pick a little from this tree and a little from that tree and you hear people's actual stories of what actually works for them, it gives you a little bit more insight as to what could actually work for you. And knowing where your boundaries are is one of the primary things that you need to be successful in this life. Correct. And in this lifestyle. Life in general. But like knowing where your boundaries are and knowing, having some examples of how to set those boundaries and how to navigate those boundaries is, I think, invaluable.

And I agree. I appreciate you taking the time to just even take a minute to, well, take an hour and some odd minutes to talk to me about what you have experienced because I think that it's really, it's good. And there was a lot of information that I gleaned from it. So I hope that my listeners also gleaned. I hope so too. Me too. I hope so too. I really, really do appreciate you doing this. I know that it's hard to like carve out an extra hour for even. No, I'm so thankful for the opportunity and I would definitely come back if, if you. Anytime, seriously, anytime. Sounds good. All right.

Hold on for me. Thank you so much for joining me today on this podcast. If you have any questions or comments or anything, you can hit me up at pineapplepinuppod at gmail.com. I look forward to hearing from you. And I would love to share your experience. If you'd like to be on the show, please reach out and let me know. I'll see you next time.