Discussion Topic: We all have experienced being judged. However, we don't often reflect on how we judge others or why so many people in the lifestyle still tend to judge. We discuss how we are wired and what influences in our lives may predispose us to our own personal bias when assessing and judging others. Try Double Date Nation free for three months! Use promo code WGTPC and join us as we help build a brand new lifestyle dating site. Listen to our friends Jay and Kay from That Couple Next Door podcast. Less than 5 rooms remain! Travel with us to Desire Pearl the week of November 16-23, 2019! Book your trip here. Join our Members Only Community
Transcript
This podcast contains explicit language and content and is for mature audiences only. Hey you teenagers out there, if you're under 18, this show is more for your parents. So now that you have that mental picture stuck in your head, put some music on and get back to doing your homework. We are a long-time married couple who's decided to chronicle our personal adventures and share our sex-positive discussions as we navigate our way through the swinging lifestyle. Care to join us?
hello everyone i'm mr jones and i'm mrs jones and we want to welcome you to episode 59 of the we gotta think podcast you don't look too good yeah i've been sick since january 3rd you haven't been healthy since 2018 pretty much yeah i'm on serious drugs now though i know and we've put this podcast off long enough yeah we keep thinking that and you know i'm still a little scratchy throat myself well my voice is fine i just have a sinus infection yeah so like yeah just don't make me move my head too quickly or it'll explode yeah but. But the show must go on. Yes. I have to give you credit, Mrs.
Jones. As sick as you've been, you've been a trooper. Well, if you say so. We've been pretty busy. Yeah, that's true. I mean, I think last time we mentioned that we were trying to see some friends that we had met a year ago and it didn't work out. Well, the last time we recorded, it was snowing that night. That's like the only good snow we've gotten this winter. Right. And it was the night of our lifestyle day. Right. That had been in the makings for a year. Yeah. But I can personally attest that the two weekends after that, we were able to get together with them, and it was worth the wait.
Yeah, we made it for lost time. Yeah. I remember testing out the hot tub. That's right. Oh, and the massage table is better than ever. Yes. We tested it out with four people, and it survived. Yeah. So we had a sexy evening with them. They're a great couple. and you know I don't know I don really connect with somebody through their eyes. And she, I kind of think she's like a force of nature. She's very beautiful. Yes, she is. Well, then after that, we just got back from San Diego. Yes. You know, it was supposed to be just a meet and greet at first. Yeah. But it kind of turned into an event.
Yeah, it evolved. And we're going to blame or give credit to our friends out there, R&M, and their posse, who helped prepare and get things ready. Like, I just can't believe what an amazing job they did putting this whole weekend together. I mean, they thought of every single little detail, and they're just super creative and super generous with their time and their resources. And it was funny. They have a pickup truck. They live local, reasonably local.
They have a pickup truck, and it took two trips to get all their stuff to know to the hotel yeah and they even picked us up from the airport and took our stuff right so i i think they made their first trip on thursday night and then um they picked us up from the airport friday at lunchtime and took us to this beautiful outdoor location for lunch and a couple other lifestyle couples and a couple of whose husbands were at work came so it was just a great beginning to our trip and then um we we pull up to the hotel and the bellboys come out to help get our luggage out of the back of the truck and then the bellboys are looking at our friend and they're like you were just here like yesterday dropping stuff off right they were like yeah yeah so what was originally a saturday evening meet and greet turned into first of all we did um oh well there was a nice hot tub and you know it was like in the 60s in san diego and it was february and they kept apologizing to us because it was so cold I'm like dude what are you talking about well one of the couples that came was from I don't know like several we had couples from Minnesota yeah Indiana Kansas the week before our meet and greet in Minnesota it was negative 50 yeah so the lady looks at our San Diego friends and she's like like dude it's a hundred degrees warmer here than it was at home like literally a hundred degrees warmer yeah so when we got there we went up on the roof and hopped in the hot tub we had to keep our clothes on but it was still nice to get into the hot swimsuits on yeah yeah right with swimsuits um started out a couple hours up there getting to know everybody as people trickled in and then we had we all went to dinner yeah across the street yeah well it's funny too in the hot tub um as people were arriving you know we had put in our on our me we we had a san diego like group chat going so we put in there hey if you're just getting in um come on up to the fourth floor where the hot tub was or whatever a couple of our friends come came up that we had met before and Bennett Desire with and it was funny because they were like wow never seen you in a swimsuit before yeah that's right yeah yeah I never really thought about that see me naked but not in a swimsuit and then after dinner we we had um a couple of we had rooms all in the same part of the hotel yeah and then one of the rooms was we had they had three massage tables set up and they had blended some their own oil concoction oh yeah they had done coconut oil um you know the the liquid coconut oil but then they had put essential oils in with the coconut oil and yeah had like several different scents and um so the planning committee made the sacrifice of getting together before our meet and greet like a month before to test out these massage oils to pick the the scent that was you know the most favorable i guess and number six was the winner number six was the winner so they brought the sacrifices our our peeps made for us honey yeah so they made they brought little bottles of number six oil that's right uh then there was another room that was set up for mrs jones to make cocktails yeah that was super fun i had a cocktail menu i felt official i know you were i know i was making cocktails for everybody kissing everybody there was a line of people out the door i know it was really fun and then you know it a lot of, I had, um, three different cocktails on the menu and then I had a nice bottle of bourbon in case the gentleman just wanted some bourbon neat.
And then I had a bottle of court 43 in case people had never tasted that before. And I had little shot glasses for the court 43. Well, a lot of people wanted to taste it cause they hadn't tried it before. And I didn't make myself a drink at all. And I think I might've had one beer at dinner. Well, a lot of people wanted to taste it because they hadn't tried it before. And I didn't make myself a drink at all. And I think I might have had one beer at dinner. Well, I couldn't let these people take these shots at La Cour 43 by themselves. So I kept taking shots with people.
And the next thing I know, I was like, man, like my nose is numb. What's going on here?
And the bottle was empty oh the sacrifices i made you know just all around yeah you know we were all just givers that weekend then we had another room that was more of the quiet socializing room so yep um and everybody coming together and these were all people from our uh we gotta thank community so they had already been getting to know each other in in our community right so it was really like a little reunion because people were finally able to put faces and names and bodies together right and it's funny because you have me we name and then you have like real first yeah what's your profile name we had to reconcile that first yeah and then you had to put the faces with the names and the Miwi names, but it didn't take long.
And a lot of people had actually shared face pictures, so we knew what most people looked like. Yeah. And it was just, it was so easy to come together. Yeah. Felt like we had known each other forever. One of the funniest things was a um, a couple of like young men walked down the hallway cause we had the doors propped open and we were, we might've been socializing a little loud. Lord, we were loud. I mean, we were decent, but some of the ladies had some sexy clothes on and these two guys stopped and they said, Hey, what's going on? Like, what kind of party is this can we we join you?
And our friend said, oh, yeah, we're a hang gliders club. And do you think the guys believed it? Well, you know, it's Southern California. I know. Like, if you're going to have a hang gliding club, this was the right area. So for the whole rest of the weekend, we called ourselves the hang gliding club.
It was a hang gliding convention oh i'm sorry hang gliding convention yeah with with massage table and cocktails so us hang gliders had fun yes we did and that was only friday night that was only friday night so saturday afternoon we all hopped in the um ferry and went over to coronado and went to coronado brewing company and we asked for a table for 35 and they didn't do badly we ended up getting at three different tables but yeah there were two huge tables and then you and i sat with some friends at a table for four yeah and um gosh we had fun oh yeah beer was good the food was good the company was Yep.
Everybody behaved. For the most part. For the most part. And then we got back in the ferry. Oh, my gosh. No, before the ferry, though, we were walking back to the ferry. Yeah. Remember we stopped right at the edge of the water. Oh, yeah. And got somebody to take a group shot. Yeah. I mean, this group shot, first of all, it's amazing because all these gorgeous, sexy swingers are in it. But the backdrop was the city, and the sky was perfectly blue. And people were saying, that background looks fake. Like it was just that pretty. I don't think I saw a picture of that. Did we get a copy of that?
Oh, I have it. Okay. So it's such a good picture. Yeah. So we had so much fun.
So we hopped in the ferry ferry went back across and um on the rooftop we did a workshop we found a tent they had pitched a tent on the roof because it's their cold season out there so we all snuck into this tent it was a huge tent yeah like you could have a wedding in this tent yeah and i think there were probably what 30 or 40 of us something like that yeah so we did a one-hour workshop talked about judgment got some good content for tonight right and then did some q a and that was a lot of fun too um and then we went back and had uh well we went out to dinner with another couple yes and i'm not going to say this a bad thing, but when you and I do these social events, it's really difficult to connect with another particular couple socially.
Right, because we're always busy. Yeah, because we're socializing with everybody and we want to be available. But I have to admit that I was interested and they invited us to dinner. Yes. And we had a great dinner getting to know them. We knew them a little bit. We had met them before. We had met them before. And they were kind of on our list of, hmm, someday I'd like to get to know them better. So then they came to San Diego and we were like, yeah. Yeah. But still, we didn't get to pull the trigger. No, but we did get to know them a little bit better. We did.
Yeah, and we hopefully have a date in the future but um after after dinner with them which was fantastic we did the main meet and greet and we had the 25 or so uh couples no yeah 25 or so couples that had showed up right plus maybe what 15 or so couples that came yeah i think there were like 15 or 20 other couples that came that night yeah it was a beautiful night they had we were on the rooftop bar in downtown san diego and it was it was a beautiful night it was chilly but they you know all the places in san diego have those big propane heaters yeah so and then they had um like group groupings around fire pits like propane fire pits like huge yeah so everybody was cuddling to stay warm and we had they all had instructions so every when everybody from our group got there we were they were to find us and we gave out bracelets so you would know who you could bother and who you should stay away from because there were non-swinger people at the club, you know, at the bar as well.
Yeah, we didn't have a takeover or anything. And it kind of looked like we were being a little cliquish, but I would say everybody was like huddled around the fires. Right. So you had to just bust your way in too. Right. It wasn't that people were closed off. It's just that it did get a little chilly that night. And so we were all huddled around the fires. But we had such a good time. We did. Thank you.
your way into right if it wasn't that people were closed off it's just that it did get a little chilly that night and so we were all huddled around the fire but we had such a good time we did so many great couples there yep i think we're all in withdrawal this week i know well it gave us good momentum for our next meet and greet which is in atlanta yes on april 26 and 27th and we're going to put some more information out um on that upcoming but you know we do have an events page on our website so if you have an interest in that you can go there and sign up and we'll be sending out an email soon yeah with what that looks like but that's also going to be a friday night saturday night yes deal it is so yeah it's going to be a whole weekend thing and we have a special guest coming with us we do yes our friend katherine from um I don't know.
it is so yeah it's going to be a whole weekend thing and we have a special guest coming with us we do yes our friend katherine from um the flip your lid episode on jealousy that she did with us and the drama episode that she did with us about the adult chair and the adolescent chair yes um yes so she and her husband will be um coming for the whole weekend and she's gonna do a workshop with us on saturday and she's gonna do some sensual yoga yes she's actually a certified yoga instructor and she does sensual couples yoga yes so she's gonna offer that class as well so that's gonna be a bonus yeah oh and then and then the other bonus is that after our meet and greet on saturday our kind of happy hour meet and greet, we're going to go to Trapeze.
Yes, we are. Which is super exciting for you and I since we don't have access to clubs around here, at least not easy access. Yes, and we've been to Trapeze before, and we know what an awesome club it is. So this will be a little bit different than San Diego, but there's a whole lot of interest, and we're just really excited to do that. And then stay tuned because next month we might even be able to tell you when and where the next meet and greet is going to be. We're already starting to plot that one out. Right. Or you can meet us in Naughty in New Orleans. That's coming up. That's right.
We're going to do a workshop there and probably host a meet and greet. Have you made our hotel reservations yet? No, because I want to get in the Saint. We're going to stay in the other hotel this year. Yeah, I'm looking forward to checking that one out. Yep. Yeah, and then here's some new information. So we met some friends about a year ago, and they came into town and had dinner with us. And they said, look, we really, you know, your podcast really resonates with us. And they've been active in our community.
And they came to us about a year ago and they said, we're going to build a lifestyle dating website. And I'm thinking, well, that's a tough. That's a big task to take on. That's a big order because there are many of them and, you know, a lot of people like some and there's some big complaints about some and it's hard to get critical mass. But what intrigued us with this is that their idea was, you know, we want to build a website where everybody feels welcome.
And even if you don't want to have sex with other people if you just want to get to know people and socialize with people that you might connect with but don't feel pressure to play with that's going to be a part of what they you know their site is all about right and so it's launched yes it it is just now launching so it's called double date nation yeah so you can find it at double date nation d-o-u-b-l-e-d-a-t-e-n-a-t-i-o-n and we'll have that on our website as well but and in the show notes but double date nation.com it's a great slick brand new interface oh it's yeah the technology is outstanding it's very user-friendly.
It's a great, slick, brand new interface. Oh, it's, yeah, the technology is outstanding. It's very user-friendly. It's very intuitive. It's just, it's sleek. It's sexy. Yes. It's user-friendly, and it just has, they've thought of virtually everything. Yeah. Well, if you can, if you're a part of a site now, and you can think of the things you don't like about it, they've really taken care of everything. Can I just say one little thing that I absolutely love about it? What? This is silly, but, but it's actually so cool. It has an eject button. Oh yeah.
So if you're in there looking around and you know how it is, like you have that, oh shit moment when somebody comes up and there's it like something on your computer screen that you don't want them to see or something on your phone that you don't want them to see and you're like trying to like hit the back button or you know like close it out and you're like panicking and you know just hitting anything well it there's always a little button that is the eject button and when you hit that you click on it you well yeah you click on it it takes you out of double date nation to to some inane no it takes you you program what you want right right it's an automatic link to take you to the weather channel or yeah if you program the weather channel then you click that button and the pop the weather channel right right no foul.
Yeah. So, you know, but so they've thought of all those little things that can either annoy you or make a website inconvenient. Well, the ease of use, the design, it's really beautiful. It's intuitive. So there's not a lot you have to try to figure out. You can do chatting within it. You can build a group within it. I mean, there's a whole lot of reasons why you would never need to leave that ecosystem or that environment. That is one really cool thing about it because a lot of the lifestyle websites, they're kind of clunky to communicate with people.
Like maybe it's easy to set up your profile and search for people and stuff. But then when you actually want to start like emailing them, it can be a little cumbersome. You usually take it outside. Yeah. To kick or something. But this website is actually built to easily connect with people. Yes. Like kind of offline, but within that website. Yes. So, and the thing that I like about it, and obviously it's new. And so it's going to take a while to get up to some critical mass. But this site and this mentality reminds me a lot of our community because at San Diego we had, what, how many couples?
Well, 25 with us all weekend. And they connected before the event, and I think in our community we have 300 and some people in there now. And what we've learned is it's quality over quantity. Yeah. You know, so and some of these websites really populate themselves with fake profiles just so you think that there's a lot of people in there. Right. So the whole philosophy here is, yeah, it's going to take a while to get some people in there.
But the people that are going to be in there, you're going to have a greater chance to connect with right i believe so anyway double date nation.com we are really going to try to help them promote this and if you would like to try it out for three months for free just use the promo code wgtpc and you can sign up and when you do please look for us and send us a friend request that's right we're on there we have our profile all built up and ready to go yeah we have pictures on there yeah we just need some friends yeah just need some friends but it's grown i mean we've opened it up to our community and they're in there playing around with it but uh brand new um please come and join us i think you when it gets to be full maturity, it's going to be a really great site.
Yes, it is. So if you haven't booked Desire Pearl yet, before we get into our topic, there's just like a couple of master suites left. Well, there's penthouses left too if you've won the lottery. That's true.
Last month we said that there were 10 master suitesites and i know that we've sold five or six or seven of them since then yeah so we're getting down to the nitty-gritty so you you should probably book if you want to go because it's gonna it's gonna book out this month right and we're gonna be there november 16th to the 23rd yeah and then you're gonna be emailing me and you're gonna say how, how can I get in? And I'm going to say, didn't you listen? Better luck next year. Because we're about at the same capacity of people that we had last year. Yep. That's going to be a lot of fun.
So, is that it for keeping up with the Joneses? I think that was plenty. All right. When we come back, we're going to talk more about judgment and what that means in the lifestyle. Welcome to segment two, judgment in the lifestyle. So let's be honest, nobody likes to be judged. Of course not. Especially those of us who choose to live this life on our own terms, right? So you're talking about swingers? Yeah. Yeah, when we were at... Just say it.
And I got intrigued by this because when we did the recording at Desire, which is at the end of our last episode, and Daryl from Swinging Down Under said, you know, raise your hands if you feel like you've been judged. And a lot of the hands went up. And then he said, now raise your hand if you've judged others. And not as many hands went up. And I said, well, that's really interesting. Well, I think he kind of threw the bullshit flag too. He did. He did.
And it led us to think that, you know, we really haven't talked about this, so let's delve into this term a little bit and see what it really means and then see if we can understand why we tend to judge others, especially in the lifestyle. I think this is a really negative topic, but you've tried to convince me otherwise. It's a real topic. You can call it happy or sad or whatever, but the reality is there's a lot of judging that goes on in the lifestyle. Well, there's a lot of judging that goes on in the world. Correct. Right. And that's a good place to start. Okay.
So believe it or not, I did a little bit of research. I'm not just going to talk off the top of my head. And this is really not controversial information here. But I did look, I've noted Dr. Elizabeth Hall from Psychology Today. And basically, if you just Google search judgment, I mean, there's two types of attributions around judgment. The first one is situational. So just to understand judgment a little bit, to set the tone, situational judgment means we believe somebody else's behavior is due to something in their situation.
Like when something happens or somebody cuts you off or somebody's rude to you and you say, well, they must be having a bad day. You know's you know you're not taking responsibility for that you're just saying well the situation that they're in you know they're just having a bad day yeah and then the second is the second attribution is personality attribution and that's where we get into a little bit of trouble because that's about the person's character. So they're either, you know, they do the same thing. They cut you off or they are rude to you.
And instead of saying, oh, they're having a bad day, you say, well, that person is just impatient or they're unkind or they're rude or something is wrong. He's an ass. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Or you flip them off. Yeah. So you, you, it's more of a, you, you perceive it as a personal attack and then it's a character assessment of the other person. It's not the situation. It's just a character flaw.
So one thing I remember, um, Daryl talking about at desire when we had that, uh, little seminar thing in the disco is that he was explaining how as human beings that our brains are wired to make instantaneous judgments about people and about the situations that we're in.
And it was basically a defense mechanism because you know like back in like prehistoric times when you would run into another tribe of people you had to instantly assess are they friend or foe right you know or if if i'm after the you know the same if i'm a hunter and i'm after the same animal as another person am i do i have the skills and the higher skill sets to be able to to this animal to feed my family? Right. So you're making these instantaneous judgments without any ability to assess.
So I think that that instinct is still wired within us, even though we go to the grocery store and buy our food now, and we just get mad at bad drivers we but we're still wired that same way correct and so in the lifestyle what that means is the same thing right whether it's competition or whether it's judging whether you're going to be compatible with somebody so like at a meet and greet for example you know you go in there and there's always that one couple that everybody's like drawn to so it's kind of the same thing you're you're instantly like assessing and judging other people to see if you're going to measure up or if you know or maybe you're looking for other people and you're assessing whether or not you're going to be compatible.
You're doing this all on the fly. Yeah, and even when you're flipping through, speaking of Double Date Nation and lifestyle websites, when you're flipping through profiles and you see a couple of pictures and you read a paragraph or two, you're instantly making that judgment or that know, is this person going to be compatible with me or not, or should I just move on? Right, right. Well, I think that just knowing that we have these like internal like mechanisms in place to make these instant judgments, if you're aware of that, maybe you can train yourself to take a breath and step back.
What a great idea. I know, right? Okay, podcast over. We can go have sex now. Yeah.
Well, I mean, we talked about, you know, if you're really going to find out if that initial judgment or assessment is accurate, there's only one way to do that that and that's to expend the time and the energy you know to understand get to know that other person right right so that's what we don't have during the day and during our lives we don't have time to do that but in the lifestyle we need to do that so how uh okay so let's say we're at desire i can't say a lifestyle club because we never get to go um so desire is something that i'm familiar with so we're at desire and let's say we've been there for a couple days and then all of a sudden we see a new couple come in you know they have their street clothes on and their backpacks and they're going down to have some lunch before they check in and we're we're making that judgment fresh meat yeah the fresh meat oh yeah okay let's just make it worse they've got the yellow bracelets on because they're newbies right yeah so they're fresh meat and we're we're assessing and and judging them right on whether or not we want to actually get out of the pool and dry off and go eat lunch and meet them right and what are we judging physical characteristics yeah physical characteristics you might be able to um assess a little bit about their relationship just by body language and stuff yeah like are they holding hands are they talking with each other yeah do they look nervous does does she look angry because she didn't know where he was right did he drag her there under false pretenses yeah i don't know but yeah so you're you're kind of like weighing all that.
Yeah, you can make that instant assessment that there's something good or bad about their relationship. Is he tall? Is he short? What color is his skin? Does he have hair? What is he wearing? I mean, but all of that mostly, right, is observations from afar. Yeah, true. No conversation at all. Right, right. So how do we know the difference between judgment and assessment? Well, to be honest, you and I have been talking about this a lot. Yeah. Because I don't think I really... By talking, you mean arguing. No. There's a difference between... See? Here we go. You're doing it now.
No, I'm trying to understand where you're coming from because I see judgment. I think it's a vocabulary gap. I don't think you and I have a difference of opinion gap. I think we have a difference in the way we're explaining it or wording it. So, so a wee bit can kind of struggling on the direction that we wanted to go in because like, for example, um, Mr. Jones is talking about judgment as a strong response to something. And I'm saying if a couple trots down the stairs from desire on the way to lunch, and I haven't seen them before, and I look at them and I say, Ooh, they're really hot.
Or I say, Hmm, I don't think so. I don't think that's a strong response. I think that's just me making an instantaneous assessment, which is not the wisest thing to do, but I don't think I'm judging those people. To me, if you want to know what I think about judgment, I'm actively listening. Okay. You're a good husband. I think judgment comes into play in a negative fashion. When I say, Oh, I would never play with somebody 20 years younger than me. I would never play with somebody. That's not my race.
I would never play with somebody that who knows is soft swap because I'm a full swap couple, you know, never or i'm always going to look for this type of person you know that's going to end up biting you in the butt right either by giving you a bad reputation in the lifestyle oh well they you know they won't do that or they've got to have this or you know just if you're too picky that makes you close-minded right and that to me is when you become a judgy mcjudgersen so what so okay now mr jones has to like corral that in and frame it yeah so if i make an assessment and and you're saying that that's a neutral statement It's not strong, or it's not judgment, and my assessment is I'm not interested.
Right. And you compare that to me saying I'm looking at that person, and I'm definitely not interested because I'm never going to do this because of their age, isn't there still something that's triggering the negative in me? Yes. I think we have these boxes that we put people in. Right. And I think when you start taking the packing tape and putting it across the box that you've put all these people in, that's when you become judgy. You're not going to let those people out of the box because they're in their too old box. Okay. Where you and I might be for some people. Let's not go there.
We're being real here, honey. So why did we put them in the box to begin with? Because they're not like us. Okay. Or we're not attracted to them. Well, right. There might not be chemistry. Okay. But a lot of times people judge other people because they're not like them. I'm a good driver. He's a bad driver. He's an ass. So what is it about people that are not like us that makes us have a negative assessment or judgment? Oh, that could be tons of things. Okay. Now we're getting somewhere.
So it could be could be i find them intimidating so therefore i have to justify the fact that i'm not going to approach them right you know they're so pretty they must be stuck up or you look at a people and there's like dripping and you know diamonds or wealth or whatever oh well you know you can tell they're really rich so they're going to be pretentious and snobby now you're being negative because you could look at somebody who's really attractive and say oh my gosh i they're just out of my league right they're so beautiful right that's exactly what i'm getting at yeah if they're not like you right your your natural instinct and it's back to that whole defense mechanism yeah you're you're gonna find a reason to not want to approach them Thank you.
Your natural instinct, and it's back to that whole defense mechanism. Yeah. You're going to find a reason to not want to approach them. Yeah, but what I'm trying to shoehorn in here is that we are attracted to people like us because that's who we've been surrounded by. They're safe. Well, in well not so much in our neighborhood yeah true our family our skin color our religion where we go to school um what we the marketing stuff that's put on the tv that or the magazine that we, all of that is influencing us and helps us define who we're attracted to. Yeah. Right?
So when we see something that falls outside of that, it's unfamiliar. Right. And so let's just not even call it judgment. Let's call it assessment. Use your word. It's something that I've never been exposed to. It's not like me. So my tendency is to not spend the time to find out. Right. So what are we saying about all of that? Well, that person's being judgy. Okay. So you were right. It was a communication issue because that's exactly what it is. Did you hear that? He said I was right. Yeah. I can edit that out.
So let me ask you personally, have you met, okay, in the time that we've been in the lifestyle have have you how have you handled these assessments yourself compared to like when we first got in the lifestyle compared to now oh well at first you're you're very much um looking for people that are like you yes because like i just said they're safe and you're scared to death when you're new and um you know so you're looking for for a situation that's going to be comfortable right and isn't that good um or it's not bad there's nothing wrong there's nothing wrong with that right right because you're scared you're already taking a chance of your comfort zone.
Why would you why would you go way out of your comfort zone and try to connect with somebody who initially upon assessment or judgment that you wouldn't be interested in? Right. Right. So contrast that to now. Well, you know, now I think, um, I think it's easier now because we're kind of slow, you know, we're very social and we really are interested in getting to know people.
So I, I find people interested, if interesting, even if I don't feel any chemistry with them and sometimes over the course of a conversation all of a sudden there is chemistry that develops yes you know but but again i'm more inter interested in getting to know them and then you know if we end up having a sexual connection that's great but that isn't really my main now because, um, not that we're all that, but because we've been in the lifestyle for a while, we have quite a few couples that we've maintained friendships with.
So we, we do have people that we can connect with when, when we want to. Um, so we, we're not constantly on the prowl i guess for new people so therefore i'm less uh anxious about making that connection which makes me more open-minded there i got to finish my sentence okay let me try to read or digest that you're um because you're not so concerned about our relationship being affected by the lifestyle, and we've met a lot of great people, it's easier for us to step out and take the time to meet people that aren't like us. Okay. Yeah. You did a good job. Summarizing. Okay.
Did you hear that everyone? She said, I did a good job. Oh, I think we like each other, honey. I mean, I can say personally that, I mean, let's, practically speaking, like in, we live in Washington, D.C. It's a very diverse area. And I've worked with people of all races.
And so that, to me, that was a part of my comfort zone to begin with right but age was a little bit different so I can say that initially when we got into the lifestyle the first thing that came to my mind when I saw somebody in their 20s or early 30s was that they're our kids age right and those words they're our kids age almost gave me like a built-in excuse Thank you. They're our kid's age. Right. And those words, they're our kid's age, almost gave me like a built-in excuse not to go there. Right.
And so, but what we've learned, at least what I've learned, is that there are younger couples who have solid relationships, who have a lot in common with us that I would have never otherwise learned had I had ever been. There are younger couples who have solid relationships, who have a lot in common with us that I would have never otherwise learned had we not taken the time to sit down and get to know them. Right. I mean, I agree with you 100%. Right. And who I find attractive, another confession. Okay, I grew up with Farrah Fawcett. She hung on my bedroom wall. Charlie's Angels. Yeah.
I mean, that's what I saw on TV. That's what I saw in the movies.
That's what my friends carried around with them them and so that's what i was attracted to so so initially even though i worked in a diverse area it never crossed my mind like i could be attracted to somebody from a different race it just it wasn't a part of who i was right but i'll tell you now i have seen some beautiful women of all races you played with them too and i have and and it is a learning experience and a growing experience but my i think the point though is that we should not have the expectation that those first getting in the lifestyle we shouldn't judge them since we're talking about this for being judgy We'll be right back.
expectation that those first getting in the lifestyle we shouldn't judge them since we're talking about this for being judgy right because that that's where we were right and so when someone comes across as angry at me because they think i judge them and i'm like dude what are you talking about i don't even know know what I'm doing here. I'm not even ready to play with somebody that's my own race and age. And you're judging me for whatever. And so it's not putting yourself in that person's shoes.
And so there's that automatic tendency to judge that they are a bad person because they shouldn't do that. And in the lifestyle, hearing a message like that can turn you off from the lifestyle. Yes, it can. And I don't worry, but I always wonder what's going through people's minds as they're getting up the nerve. Cause we, we talked to so many people that are brand new to the lifestyle and are getting ready to have their first experience. And they say any words of wisdom, you know, before we go to our first club or our first hotel takeover or, or, you know, whatever the event may be.
And, you know, just go with an open mind. And that's so easy to say. Right. And it's so hard to carry out. Right. You know what? I think we should talk about San Diego a little bit more. Oh, well, we, we kind of had that going into San Diego because, so we had 25 couples travel with us and, um, we had, there was a lot of buildup in the planning. And, you know, so we talked about having the cocktail room in one of the suites. And then we talked about having, um, a massage room because there were three massage tables. And then of course all the beautiful massage oil that was brought.
And that freaked some people out. Yeah. And then we had a couple that had a lot of experience in the BDSM community. Yeah. And they were talking about flogging. And then a lot of people got really intrigued by flogging. So they were like, oh, I think you should do a flogging demonstration. And he's like, well, yeah, if people want that, I'd be glad to do that. Well, then some of the nervous newbies were like, holy smokes, what am I getting myself into? So then we kind of had to backpedal a little and say, you know what? There's going to be something for everyone.
You know, if, if, um, you know, and, and some people do have issues with flogging because they might, might've had a negative experience with, um, abuse of some sort and they don't respond well to that. So I'm like, you know what? You can hang out with me in the cocktail room. We're going to just drink and chat. And then the massage room, you know, you can go in the massage room and watch. You don't have to participate if that's not your comfort level. So, you know, we were trying to create an environment where there was something for everyone.
But then the new people that had never had any kind of experience before, and there were quite a few of them, were really letting themselves get intimidated by the more experienced people that were like really into, Oh my gosh, the massage room is gonna be so amazing. And Oh my gosh, I can't believe I'm going to bring my flogger. And, you know, and there was just so much excitement and buildup. It was freaking some people out. And, and I don't think there was really judgment going on between the newbies and the experienced people.
But, you, if, if, um, the experienced people hadn't have been the amazing people they were and they sensed that and, and they reached back and, you know, and we were joking around, well, we're going to be gentle with you. Um, there could have been some judgment like, Oh, this, this crowd's going to be too crazy. Well, the first thing that happened was we said, as mama bear, I know we said, trust us. Yeah.
yeah we're gonna hold your hand we're gonna make sure nothing happens and we're gonna make sure everything's a comfortable setting yeah so that they had that reassurance going in and then secondly let me tell you what i observed so in the massage room there were people in the massage room that were nervous there were people in the massage room that probably didn't want to be in the massage room it was a stretch for them to be in there yeah as people hopped up on the table and i have to admit i was one but when i wasn't on the table i was observing the room and the room room went from being a little bit nervous, you know, the nervous laughter and things like that, to once the massage started, people started relaxing.
And I'm talking about the people just around the room, not the ones on the table. And you could just tell that people are like, oh, this is really nice. Yeah. Somebody's not going to attack me. Nobody picked me up and threw me on the table. Nobody's forcing me over there to do that. No, and the massages, they were sensual massages, but there was no sex in the room. Right, and people would walk up to the table and start massaging if they wanted to.
So it really changed, the atmosphere in the room changed and everybody got really comfortable but i think even what's cooler is that our friends that had the bdsm skills they were amazing they were amazing so what happened was they ended up doing a flogging kind of a demonstration in the room on saturday night on saturday night which was perfect because people had had a whole nother day to connect right right yes right and so we knew them everybody trusted them they got these um floggers out and their tools and everything else their accoutrement and they were looking for volunteers and so somebody stepped up and volunteered and you know you make a judgment i am not into whatever kink I'm not into flogging I'm not into whatever but if you were in that room and you watch somebody say yes I trust you and I want you to do that to me and then you watch the gentleman or the lady holding the flogger say okay this is what's going to happen here's what I using.
This is where I'm going to start. This is how we're going to communicate. You're going to say this word, if it's okay, you're going to say this word, if you want more, and you're going to say this word, if you want me to stop, I'm going to check in with you. Your spouse is going to be standing right here. And all of that dialogue happened and you could just see people relax. And then it started up and the presentation of what was stated actually came about. Oh, yeah. And as more and more people volunteered for that, some willingly, and then some of us maybe not so willingly.
You did good, honey. Ugh, we'll talk about that later. It became like, wow, that's pretty cool. You know what? Maybe I'm not into that, but that person is definitely into it and I can see what she's getting out of it. And I'm not going to judge that or assess that as something that's wrong or that people that do that, they're weird. Right. Because we watched people do it and we watched people learn. And then what was the conversation that we had with the gentleman, the couple that was doing the flogging, their experience? Well, their initial background was a BDSM background. Right.
So they would go to those types of events, and when they found out that they were also part of the swinging lifestyle that other people in that bdsm community not all the other people but some of the other people would um be a little put off by that yeah so they were being judged right by a different like genre of, you know, I guess. Sex positive. Yeah, sex positivity, just another different way of expressing your sexual desires. Right. There are all these little sub-genres. Right.
So what I'm saying is, not only did the people who volunteered to be flogged have to step out of their comfort zone and trust, but the two people that were doing the flogging had had a negative experience. Where they were judged. Where they were judged. Yes. And they were taking a risk. True. And offering this up again. Because what if everyone in that room said, oh, we're swingers, we're not BDSM? Then that would have damaged them. But there was none of that. It was curiosity. And part of the reason why, when you and I talked about this afterwards, is because guess what?
We all invested the time and the energy to understand and get to know that couple. And so when they had floggers in their hands they weren't bdsm people they were joe and mary yeah we know them we trust them right and therefore we're gonna go they weren't defensive they were they were very educational and you could ask them anything right and they they were just an open book and they were they just had the perfect personalities personalities to demonstrate that and to really expose people to something brand new. Right. It was amazing.
So I think in the macro level, we exposed a lot of newbie people to both swinger and BDSM stuff in the same room. They probably don't even know there's a difference. It's just a different way to play. It's like when you grow up in a household with two fathers or you grow up in a school with a black teacher or you, it's normal. You don't, you know, or you have a friend that's gay. You don't think of it as being abnormal because it's a part of your beginning. So I kind of felt pretty good about that, that our folks had this experience and it was a positive thing.
And now they're not going to have this bias against people who like flogging. They're in the kink community, right? Yeah, exactly. No, I thought that was super cool. And that was kind of how the weekend ended. I just thought that was kind of like a crescendo, literally. Right. And I think as we start to close up, I talked about when we did our workshop. In the tent. In the tent. And we got home and we got an email from one of our guests who was there. And she sent us a saying that I wanted to share. Yeah, it's pretty cool. So this is, quote, It's easy to judge.
It's more difficult to understand. Understanding requires compassion, patience, and a willingness to believe that good hearts sometimes choose poor methods. Through judgment, we separate, and through understanding, we grow. And if you were to put this mantra in the lifestyle, this is what we should all be striving for. Yes, absolutely.
In the real, in the outside world where we're expected we we put up with this judgment all the time and we do it ourselves i think we could use the lifestyle as a way to teach people how to not separate but grow together right and you know not everybody in that room walked away into flogging absolutely not you know i'm one of them you know it might not be your thing but everybody was curious and respectful yeah and and i think they appreciated the exposure to it yes because i mean it was beautiful and it was hot because it was done right and it was done with emotion and compassion.
You know, people can't fake being turned on. No. I watched a woman who I know very well. Yeah, one of our good friends. I watched her back get red and her ass get red and her husband was standing there and she was clearly enjoying herself. I know, she was so beautiful. And not only could this gentleman flog, he did the rope work on her. Oh, right. And he took this beautiful rope and he essentially made a teddy out of rope. It was just all string. And it was so beautifully done.
It was perfection yeah and and it just really enhanced her body and then she had that on when he was vlogging her and yeah it was just visually it was just so cool yeah yeah it was pretty amazing i mean that was really the first time you and i had been exposed at that level and i i learned a lot that night. It was really interesting. I think we've managed to take something negative and turn it into something positive. Hopefully. I hope so. If we didn't, don't judge us for it. I know.
So I think that the big takeaway is, you know, try to be aware that there's a difference between assessing and judging. You know, those words, there's so many times you hear like a teacher or a parent say, you know, never say never. Or, you know, don't say, oh, everybody else does it. Or this always happens. Those words can be very divisive.
You know, so don't't say i'll never play with anybody older than me or i'll never play with anybody younger than me or a different race than me or a different play style than me you know that whole never is going to bite you in the ass and it's going to uh potentially make you miss some opportunities so yeah and i think my closing thoughts are from both sides of it so if if i'm going to choose to assess or judge and and i don't want to spend time with somebody else there's absolutely nothing wrong with that right it's my choice to do that i'm the one that may be losing out but it's still my choice you choice not to engage with somebody else.
If I'm on the other side of it and somebody, if I feel like somebody is judging me or if I feel like somebody has said I am too old or too tall or too white or whatever that too is, if I spend any time at all worrying about that I'm just hurting myself yeah that too is if I spend any time at all worrying about that I'm just hurting myself yeah you gotta let it roll off your back yeah I am not going to take somebody else's judgment and spend a minute on it in in my mind and in my life and if I allow that to happen then I'm I'm allowing that person's decision to judge me or assess me to influence my happiness and the decisions and choices that I make.
I think that's where we get into a lot of trouble is we get angry and defensive when somebody judges us. And guess what we do? We judge them right back. back yeah and so when you get into that cycle two wrongs don't make a right you get into you get into the separation that this quote is talking about we're separating so you and i for example if somebody says we're too if no one would say it but if we perceive that nobody to, this couple doesn't want to be with us because of our age, that's fine. Right. We don't lose any sleep over that. We go, we just go meet somebody else.
There's plenty of people out there. Right. And it does sting at first. Sure. I mean, come on, like, let's be real.
It's not a good feeling to know that you're being judged for something that that you can't control i can't control the fact that i'm old i can't control the fact that i'm white i can't control the fact that you know i i live in this part of the country you know if people are going to judge me because of that you know there's there's certain things out of your control right so you just have to acknowledge that and and let it roll off your back the things that you can control you know as far as like how you interact with people or you know how open your mind is you know if you're getting judged because of that kind of stuff then you know maybe that's an opportunity to kind of reflect right and and in real world um where it's your boss or a family member or a friend and you can't just walk away obviously you need to decide how to how to approach that and how to improve that relationship yeah but i can guarantee you that being judgmental back is not going to solve the problem no it's not yeah so anyway let's try to should we sing kumbaya now practically i feel like i've totally gone into mom mode never say never and this i'm only going to say this once i know we've talked about this in ad nauseum but when we're in the lifestyle we should be held to a higher level of accountability for not judging others.
Yeah, that's true. Just like if you're a Christian, you should be held to a higher, to love one another. So it's easy to say, if you're going to judge me, I'm going to judge you. But I'm just suggesting that because all of us have made this choice, we've opened our minds and and we are stepping into this world, and we're learning about it, and we don't want others to judge us for it, we should be a lot more sensitive to judging others. That's my point. I mean, you might not agree with other people. It might not be, their thing might not be your thing. Right.
let it be right yeah okay well that's judgment what other world problems can we solve tonight i know that's a that's a big one well when we come back hopefully we're gonna think of a snapshot or two to share with you you know the thing about it is when you're sick for seven weeks in a row there's not many snapshot opportunities i know i know it's been kind of rough yeah well we'll be back in a minute or two depending on how long it takes mrs jones to come up with a snapshot i got one okay we'll be right back welcome back to snapshots i want to go first okay you're the boss so my snapshot has to be about san diego because i mean i'm still flying high too yeah just so much fun it's quite the boss.
So my snapshot has to be about San Diego because, I mean, I'm still flying high, too. Yeah. Just so much fun. It's quite the trip. It just totally exceeded my expectations. So not that I had expectations. Oh, I shouldn't have said that. Oops. My hopes. Yeah. But anyway, you know, like Mr. Jones said earlier in the episode, you know, we, we, uh, are very concerned about hosting and making sure everybody's having a good time and everybody's connected and nobody's feeling like, you know, lost or, or whatever. So we, we really try to, um, focus on our guests.
And I remember, especially when, like I referred to earlier, you know, a lot of people were like, Oh my gosh, there's gonna be a massage room, there's gonna be a flogging demonstration, like, what am I getting myself into? So I truly was kind of in mama bear mode. And I knew who the newbies were to kind of keep an eye on. And, and luckily, my job was quite easy, because there were no shrinking wallflowers hiding in the corner. Everybody was connecting extremely well.
But I remember thinking to myself, well, I'm not even going to go in the massage room because, you know, I don't need to be in there. I can just stay in the cocktail room or the quiet room and just kind of socialize with people. Well, the cocktail room kind of emptied out.
And I like where is everybody so you and i wondered uh you know we kind of stuck our heads out in the hallway and then that's how you and i ended up in the massage room and then i'm in the massage room and and it was uh nobody were on the nobody was on the table we first walked in right no so it was just kind of social time and then somehow somebody got on the table I wasn't the first one right I don't know I had had all those shots at the core 43 I might not remember no but anyway so then the massage just kind of started back up and I was like oh wow so I walked over and I was kind of maybe I don't know helping a little bit but i wasn't like super involved and then all of a sudden i realized that it was okay and i i could stop being in like host mode and just enjoy myself because i'm looking around the room and everybody was just like there was a lot of just really positive energy right and then the next thing i know which is the exact opposite of what i thought would happen is i got on the massage table and i was really nervous like that's stupid yeah like i've done that before i've been naked at desire but i had to take my clothes off in front of everybody right like mrs jones had to take her dress and her panties off because everybody knows i always wear panties and i had to get on the massage table and i'm like wow i'm gonna be naked in front of all these people and they're gonna touch me and i you and i haven't even talked about this i was terrified but of course once i got up there and all that positive energy started flowing through my body well nobody left yeah nobody was like ew nobody walked out nobody left and and then it just ended up being just a great experience because then i was able to trust the situation not that i didn't trust the people right i just felt weird being up there i didn't anticipate doing that and then i'm like how did i end up you know being the one on the table because i don't like being the center of attention and but i liked that a lot it was really hot yeah you thank you for sacrificing yourself i know it was yeah there were a lot of sexy people because then And they were touching me i know after you got up there then i felt obligated to get up there too and i don't know who was massaging my feet but holy shit they knew what they were doing it wasn't me i i don't think i massaged you you didn't no because you had quite the crowd i didn't want to oh i didn't want to steal any've massaged you before.
Well, I was selfish because when you got on the massage table, I was at the good place. Yes. I got the good stuff. Yeah, you did. Yeah, that was fun. Yeah, my hands started wandering a little bit when I was getting my massage. I think my ass was one of the asses you were playing with. Yeah. They had one on each side of me. Yeah, you did. You're a lucky guy. Yeah. No, that was super fun. I just really enjoyed, you know, you were the only guy that got on the massage table when we were in there. Yeah. I know guys were on there earlier, but you were the only guy I got to massage.
I might have to rectify that in a future meet and greet. Definitely. Yeah. Well, so I was also, I was not the only other guy that got flogged too. No, you weren't. So my snapshot is about me being flogged and if i'm being honest i really was a brat i didn't want to do it you know and i kind of got asked once or twice and i kept saying no well they didn't really give up so i said you know okay you know i'll do this well you could have used your could have. I'm not blaming anybody, but I didn't have the right attitude when I went into it. So I ended up taking my shirt off.
I still had my jeans on and, you know, it was, and it was a gentleman that was flogging me and he was very good. He explained everything to me. And he was explaining everything to me. I mean, I was right there with him. Yeah. And he had me participating a little bit. Right. And as he changed instruments and he told me this one's going to be a sting a little bit more than the other one, this one's going to be a thud, you know, this is going to do this. And, you know, and he would say, you know, do you, how does it feel? And, you know, are you okay? And he was checking in and all that stuff.
And it really, he was flogging me pretty hard and it didn't hurt, but it really didn't do anything for me. It didn't turn you on. No, it didn't turn me on at all. But I think part of it was because I felt a little bit self-conscious, like I was on display. You don't like being the center of attention either. And I don't like, yeah, I don't like being the center of attention. So that probably had something to do with it. However, when I was finished. Here comes the snapshot. And I thanked him because he did a good job. He did. He did a good job. He did.
And I turned around, and here was one of our beautiful new friends, who, by the way, the night before came in in a red corset. I think it was a red corset. And she was a little bashful because she was wearing this corset. And I was like, are you kidding me? Her body was made for a corset. You look fabulous. I know. Anyway, she's distracted me.
So anyway, we got finished and she came over to me and she said, well, you like it and I said well you know it was not a big deal I don't I think I have a neutral experience and she said really well I think it was just watching you I thought I was hot and I said oh really and then all of a sudden because she told me that that she thought it was hot all of a sudden my memory of it got a whole lot better huh that's interesting yeah so i think what it is for me is that i had no relationship with the leather you know it was hitting me yeah and i was facing a wall yeah and it was just me and the flogger but as soon as as soon as she said it was hot it was like i had a connection with somebody oh okay i need i need that human connection i need to connect and maybe you know i don't know if it was a female flogger it would have been any different i didn't have any problems with the way he was flogging me but when she told me that i was like okay well that turns me on if i know that it's turning somebody else on then then it's going to turn me on and then i thought well i wonder if the whole experience would have been different if like she would have come up to me and said you know what you know what really turns me on is when guys get flogged because i probably would have been thinking about her right being turned on right and then the hitting may have turned me on i don't know but maybe that's on my bucket list for next time oh so you hopefully you're listening um and you know who i'm talking about young lady so you can come to the next one, and we can do a do-over.
Oh, that's an excellent plan, Mr. Jones. Yeah. Way to reel him right in. Yeah. So it was really interesting, because I think if she would not have said that to me, it would have been kind of a, eh, I don't think I'll ever do that again. Yeah.
So now your mind is open well and it's you know when it when a when a couple just i was listening to um that couple next door today and jay and k were talking about sitting down with another couple and talking as a group what they wanted to try and they were saying everything that we threw out there everybody somebody said yeah i'd really like to do that that's what turns me on if i know that somebody else wants to do it it's going to turn me on but if you ask me hey do you want to get flogged i'm saying well no not really so that's what i like about the connectivity and the lifestyle the way the way that you and i approach it is connecting with other people yeah all right okay well so if you want to go to atlanta i can tell you that we're going to limit the number of people because i think any more than 80 or 100 people is is going to be too big yeah i mean i i think um you know for the majority of the weekend we had 25 couples and it was a nice a nice group.
I think I pretty much had a real conversation with just about everybody. Yeah. You know, when it gets too big, then you don't have the opportunity to make all those connections. Yeah, so we're going to try to put a limit on it. But if you're not, and obviously if you're in our membership community, you've already got the invitation and you can indicate that you want to go. If you're not in our community, well, you can join our community, or you can go to our website and put your name on the events page for Atlanta, and we'll send you an email about how you can attend if we have room.
We have a super venue picked out. It's really cool. Yes. It is a really cool hotel. Yeah. Speaking of our membership, we do offer three levels of membership, a monthly membership, a semi-annual and an annual. Yep. You can find that information on our website. Also on our website, we've got a host of many courses to choose from if you're looking for just a specific topic to kind of dive into.
and then of course we have our full signature course that kind of takes you from what is the lifestyle to hey let's throw a house party yes right beginning to end and not only can you join cassidy for a free trial on our website but you can join double date nation go to our website and you'll find that there get three months for free to come in and take a look around and i think we're you're really going to like what you see yep and then you know mr jones mentioned earlier that our november trip is almost sold out but you can book a trip to desire at any time through our website um we really appreciate the support you can both desire resorts temptations resort and then they're offering a host of cruises coming up too yep so all that information's on our website so it's kind of one-stop shopping yes and you can message us through our website or you can send me an email at mrjones at we got a thing.com Or MrsJones at WeGotAThing.com And of course our website is WeGotAThing W-E-G-O-T-T-A-T-H-I-N-G We got a thing dot com or Mrs.
Jones at we got a thing dot com. And of course, our website is we got a thing. W. E. G. O. T. T. A. T. H. I. N. G. dot com. You can follow us on Twitter at we got a thing. And then we also have Instagram and Pinterest accounts. Yeah. Which just kind of blows my mind. Yeah, we do. And a Facebook account as well. Oh, that's right. So thanks for listening. We are Mr. and Mrs. Jones, and we've got a thing. What's your thing? We'll see you next time.
