Want to send us a message? In this episode we discuss some of the pros and cons to the two approaches of finding play partners: FWB and DTF. Friends With Benefits (FWB)Down To Foxy (DTF)The Nirvana of the LifestylePros and Cons of FWB v. DTF Support the showWant More?👀 Watch on YouTube: YouTube ShowFull video versions and interactive live episodes!Bonus episodes, exclusive content, and 🌶️Extras: https://www.patreon.com/SwingerUniversity 🛳️🎉Looking for lifestyle events in your area? T4P is the go-to directory for clubs, parties, and resort events. Browse now at Ticket4Play.com Custom SU T-shirts and gear: Our Amazon StoreSwingerLinks.com - live schedule, special offers*, and our 🌶️links!Our Website - Leave us a message, articles, and sexy products3 Ways to get your question on our show:RECORD it on our website at: https://swingeruniversity.com/contact/EMAIL a recorded voice note to: [email protected]: (916) 538-0482 and leave a voicemail.* We get a commission if you decide to purchase through our links, at no cost to you.
Transcript
We have to talk about something we've been genuinely excited about for months, and our patrons actually got a preview of this already. Jamaica! Yes, we are going back, and actually, we have a great offer for you guys. Yeah, it's Swingcation. It's October 11th through the 18th at Hedonism 2. And if you don't know what Swingcation is, it's pretty easy. Swinger plus kink plus vacation. It's a hosted group with real structure, workshops, lectures, real conversations with experts who are passionate about bringing and bridging that gap between the swinger world and the kink world.
And we're not just going as attendees. we're going as featured presenters, which is exciting. We'll be leading sessions. So if you come, we actually get to hang out with you. Which brings up something we should mention. When you use our code, yes, we got a code, you're not just getting a discount, you're getting the signature swing experience, which means $100 off per person, up to $200 per room, but it also means that we make time for you. An exclusive breakfast, lunch, cocktail hour, or one-hour and one time with us directly, plus more surprise benefits.
Here's something that's really unique. You could actually contribute by hosting a discussion or running a Skillshare. I know it's scary, but if you have something that you want to contribute, that's a big part of why this event is so special. Everyone there has something to bring to the table. All right, details. If you book before April 25th, you save $400. Plus, they gave us that special code that gets you an additional $200, and the special code is SWINGERU-VIP. So book through TicketForPlay.com forward slash Swinkie. That's T-I-C-K-E-T, the number four, play.com forward slash S-W-I-N-K-Y.
And use our code at checkout. And you guys, if you have any questions about the event, the resort, or what to expect, just reach out. I mean, we're here for you. We're happy to help. So once again, TicketForPlay.com forward slash Swinky, the code SwingerU-VIP. We really want to see you there. Welcome to Swinger University, your horizontal enrichment program, bringing you an educational podcast about swinging. Here are your hosts, Ed and Phoebe. Hi, this is Ed. And this is Phoebe. Today we are talking about two common preferences in the lifestyle. Friends with benefits or DTF, down to fuck.
Making a swinger couple, your good friend, seems to be the goal. while those who just want to fuck are somehow thought as aggressive. When you start out embarking on this sexy adventure of swinging, you will always hear how couples have other couples that are friends with benefits. It is touted as this nirvana of swinging well Well, let me tell you, it is as real as getting in the mile-high club. Most swingers start out thinking friends with benefits is nirvana. The white picket fence, the house, two kids, and a great career. Not.
somehow finding that elusive couple that you connect with year after year and have many, many fuck dates becomes the goal. However, the DTF couples may actually be the people you want to fuck. Why? Because most swingers are in the lifestyle for 18 months, and chances of meeting that couple that you think will be your friends with benefits couple are really one in ten somehow dtf couples are seen as less desirable maybe they're scary they're intimidating they've got these you know high expectations that you're going to meet and you're just going to fuck. Like, put the keys in the bowl.
Head to the bedroom. Head to the bedroom. And that's a very forward-thinking approach. But DTF doesn't mean just because you meet, you have to fuck. We go to to parties all the time and it doesn't always happen you meet people both couples still have to figure out whether they are attracted to each other whether they even want to have sex they're not in the mood if you meet a couple and you are attracted to them, don't you kind of want to fuck them? Why is the friends with benefits couple more appealing?
We are going to break down pros and cons for that kind of couple pros you get more opportunities to play right they're a phone call away hey we'll bring over a bottle of wine watch a movie netflix and once the kids are off to bed we all head to the bedroom and they're dead asleep and Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm convenient it's familiar it's comfortable yeah you kind of worked out all of the kings so to speak introductions comfortable this that the other thing right you're past you're past that awkward first date phase and you're straight to the oh we know them let's invite the joneses over oh the joneses oh there are a lot of different vacations that you can have getaways your vacation becomes a a different type of vacation so it's it's fun because it's it's different than everybody else's vacation right we've heard other podcasters talk about their annual trip to Desire where they connect with the couple that they met, and it's like an annual reunion.
Yes, yes. Heck, I have never even gone to my high school reunion.
I would love to have an annual fuck date reunion i've been to both my high school reunions and i wanted to fuck at them both so there you go sharing your vanilla experiences in public can be very tantalizing you all have this private secret that's going on wink wink nudge nudge titter titter you have the you know secret sneak off to the bathroom girl conversations oh yes the oh the classic swinger game of do you think that couple over there in the corner might be swingers right right we love that game we're always asking wait wasn't he with her before and now she's with him i swear they switched wait who's with who yeah Mm hmm public kind of risky but exciting right and depending on where you are it could be totally risk-free yes in a far away city so us visiting san francisco for example sure anything.
Right. They don't know who we are. Although we have run into people we knew. Right. But yeah, it's kind of fun to flirt outside the bounds and make everybody else go, wait a second. Are they swingers? Isn't that my boss? I thought his wife was a brunette. What? Ruh-roh. The cons. You can get too enmeshed in each other's world.
We've heard about long-term relationships where typically with a unicorn but it isn't always a unicorn sometimes it's the other woman that few stories we've heard where she starts to get really attached and kind of crosses into that emotional relationship boundaries where it's not just innocent fun right or you how do i say in each other's lives so much you're sharing so much of the day-to-day vanilla you're going to each other's kids soccer games right you're doing all this other extra vanilla things together that it it kind of tends to be too much a little little too much pta and not enough dtf exactly another con is you tend to be exclusive and there's lack of variety in your lifestyle.
You do everything with this other couple and you, and it's so comfortable that you, you just, you're not, you're not having the variety that, that maybe you want and maybe you don't. Maybe that that's maybe that's what you want and some for some couples that that's great they just have that one couple and they play exclusively with them for several years three years ten years at most we've heard so it's great if that works for you, but again, you're lacking variety. Well, and the downside with that is you've put all of your eggs in that one basket.
So let's say that couple decides to get out of the lifestyle. We can name a lot of couples who used to be in the lifestyle and aren't now.
And if they had been our exclusive, then we wouldn't have been kind of curating these other relationships or meeting other couples it's kind of like breaking up with a boyfriend or getting divorced you're back in the dating scene yes starting all over again and you have no one in your little black book to call on exactly right exactly i know and you go to events and you go to parties and you run into a couple who you like to play with but now yeah you're kind of in an exclusive thing which i gotta say kind of goes against the whole swinger purpose which is they're hot what do you think honey wouldn't it be nice to take them back to our room right you know you're right and honestly let's do them we've had so many great experiences where that that have surprised me and we and we're done we're like wow I never had sex with anybody like that before or um I didn't know that I would have so much fun with her and it her her and in in the meaning of like a woman because I'm not bi but I I will play with a woman and I've had wonderful experiences so but it's it's random for me it it's based on the vibe I guess for lack of a better description right and so I've had some pretty hot experiences with women that have been surprising and i'm like oh that was pretty nice i really thought that was great of course ed's quick to say oh you are so bi i'm like well maybe i am maybe i'm not but i still prefer men you know it's more like an 80 20 thing right 70 30 this is very hard to define we have a whole other episode on that we'll just say it's a sliding scale depending on the woman right okay and the last con is being jealous of being left out when your new friends have found another couple right they want to expand their horizons because the variety sounds fun and now you're the third wheel yeah it's a little committed not quite polyamorous when we were talking about this we were trying to figure out like okay where's the line between polyamorous and the other and it's like oh they live with you or they don't but other than that it's pretty close and some of them some of these relationships there they do so much together it's yeah they yeah shop together travel together yeah everything's together now i thought of another con we've met a few couples in the lifestyle that like to play bareback and for them this whole exclusivity and the initial testing that kind of goes into that is kind of enmeshed with this friends with benefit concept that we've been talking about.
The con with that is, as we've talked about with safe sex practices, you're only as safe as the weakest link. So let's say you have this friends with benefits relationship, you playing bareback and they have a freaky night one time now you are opened up to that risky behavior now it's affecting your sex life and your friends with benefits relationship. Right.
And that's put on pause for a good three months because even though you're tested and you get your test and it comes back negative that you don't have AIDS, you still have to wait about three months to be completely safe and not have sex with anybody else. I've heard gonorrhea and syphilis are coming back too yes and stronger strains it's great being resistant to our it's the end of the days it's the apocalypse why do people tend to have a negative view on dtf? Are they seen as more aggressive, as we mentioned before? Maybe they're just passionate. Maybe they're just driven and confident.
Perhaps they don't have enough time between jobs, kids, soccer practice.
So they literally have to squeeze in some fun quickly so i encourage you to like suspend your negativity around the dtl open your mind to the tantalizing promise of dtf yes pros it's easy it's free-flowing cordial fun friendly but it's a little goal oriented so the idea is you are open to the possibility of things like fucking on the first date yes not that you're going to but but you're open to it right right good one i like it go ahead okay can we talk about october for a second oh my god yeah i've been waiting for this we were invited to be guest speakers for two engagements on a six-star crystal cruise ship with 310 lifestyle couples and it sails from Montreal to Boston during the peak foliage season I'm super excited and honestly I'm.
Yeah, it's kind of a version of like a swinger TED talk that we're going to have to do. Oh my God, I know. And more importantly, if you know the brand, it's LLV, Luxury Lifestyle Vacations. You may have seen them and they're sexy playmakers with their fun red hats. This ship, the Crystal Symphony, is classy. Butler service for every single room. Michelin rated restaurants. Full spa. Clothing optional. Sensual playrooms. Like everything. Theme nights and international DJ. So it's luxury and nudity. Oh, man, this is going to be great. The bottom line is we want you there with us.
It's 310 couples. And like all their vacations, they book up fast. They really do. Their vacations are extremely popular. So please come with us. And in order to find it, all you have to do is go to our swingerlinks.com and look for the llv sensual voyage we hope you'll join us you can keep a long-term connection but without the involvement of this whole friends with benefits kind of enmeshed relationship, there's no reason why your DTF friends couldn't be repeat offenders, right? It doesn't have to be a one-night stand. It could be a whole bunch of one-night stands. Random, hey, call them up.
They up they're as they say down to fuck yeah so why not call them again right i don't know the con one of the cons well what other pros can you think i couldn't think of any other pros of it because it's just so easy. Well, I think that's the thing. Think of DTF as more of a mentality. Yes. And open to the possibilities of it. They're like, look, we're tired of rules. We've been there, done that.
We're not all tightly wound and worried about well it's the first date we you know we really shouldn't it's like we in high school we're swingers right like i've got condoms we've got lube you want to meet other people to fuck. Hi, we're people. Would you like to fuck? It's that simple. Leave it to a man to break it down. That simply. There is a little more. All the women are out there like, I'm not just going to spread my legs for anybody.
Well, no, you've got gotta like hit it off with them but we had examples where we've met a couple and if circumstances had allowed us we would have been we were elbowing each other at the table going what do you think oh oh yeah i'd fuck them and we were like oh shit too bad we set this up in a way where we couldn't or we don't have a place or it's not going to happen. Right. And the few times where we've actually, to hell with it, let's go get a hotel room. Yeah. And then something didn't work out. Right. I know. Meh. Meh. I know. DTF relationships can move too fast for some.
And in the beginning, those did move fast for us. Because we weren't comfortable enough. We weren't ready. We didn't know all the ins and and outs we didn't have the secret handshake password i wink whatnot thing we we just didn't know it was going to happen and how it was all going to go down well and we when we first started we were only soft swap and we had a lot of rules and a lot of well if you had a lot of nervousness a lot of nervousness, a few. We had a lot of nervousness. A lot of nervousness. A few rules. Very few rules. Yeah, like two or three. Maybe three. It wasn't much.
Yeah, it wasn't as... These weren't serious rules. No. These were more like guidelines. But as we've become more comfortable yes we definitely kind of pulled the governor off and more than happy to pedal the metal the second con is this relationship interaction may feel a bit insensitive Thank you. The second con is this relationship interaction may feel a bit insensitive to you if you need more time for familiarity, because it is a very direct approach, a very confident. Very transactional. Right. Right. I brought my wife.
my wife did you bring yours right which kind of strips off all the whole friendliness and feeling you know that i mean people are obviously still very respectful all and and nice and courteous although i will say Our very first dtf couple it was pretty transactional they were nice they did have food for us yeah but it was like oh you've taken three bites of your snack great let's go to the bedroom how they were like they had busy schedules they had a system that works for them we were they traveled it was terrible so yeah it was it was interesting it was it was fun but it was it it tended to be a little more transaction they were nice they weren't i'm not saying they weren't insensitive in any regard no but we arrived at their house and it was clear that we were there for a purpose yeah right like it wasn't a random social gathering there wasn't the whole and to clarify a little bit we had met them and played with them before oh we did yes the house party with I don't know.
and to clarify a little bit we had met them and played with them before oh we did yes the house party with the red light with the red light in midtown and we went there you're gonna have to edit that midtown part out no everybody knows we live in sacramento yeah but the red light in Midtown oh nobody's gonna know that all right fine I'm leaving that in I may leave this whole thing in oh my gosh I'm a rebel outtakes but anyway we we met them at a house party in Midtown, and it was a little strange, but the party was a little strange. Why was it strange? It was kind of a weird party.
I think people were too drunk. Oh. I think that was part of it. Huh. But we had a good time. Yeah. And we had seen them and met them a couple other times before this, but we played on the same bed with them. We were like, hmm, it was kind of fun. We might do them again.
And they called us out of the blue, we got together so showing up at their house yeah and it wasn't a super bowl party and it wasn't some specific social engagement this was literally hey you want to come over to our house well what else are you gonna do right like right yeah there's a goal here there's a goal to have fun what's that like i'm fun fun yeah i know it's devoid of about a year going on a year and a half now i feel like this podcast is a little bit of a tease not only to us but to yeah all of our listeners as well i know like imagine a world where people can get together and have sex keep going this is sounding good keep going keep going please Please take me there.
Please count God. Keep going. This is sounding good. Keep going. Keep going. Please take me there. Please. Count God. If only. All right, everyone. All in all, do what's best for you and your partner. You may start out wanting more of a friendship, but migrate to not so much. We have found couples that start out making fast friends with another couple only to have it peter out. Some couples absolutely need to have both lives separate due to their careers and public profile.
The goal is to navigate these waters in the best way that honors your relationship and is respectful of your friends or soon to be friends. No more honesty, as difficult as it can be at times is truly your best foot forward when navigating your wants, needs, and desires. And in this lifestyle, there's someone out there for everyone, so do what's best for you. Yes. Before you turn off our podcast to take care of all the vanilla things pulling you away, please reach out and give us a review.
I know, mashing a star is so much easier, but a review is so much better for sharing your love of what we're doing with others. We would appreciate it. If you want to share a personal story, ask us questions, or share your comments, you can contact us at swingeruniversity at gmail dot com. Check us out at swingeruniversity dot com, where you can find links to our Twitter and Instagram feeds. Thank you for listening to Swinger University, your horizontal enrichment podcast. Oh, one last thing before you go.
If this episode helped you in any way, the single best thing you can do to support the show is leaving a rating and review. It takes 60 seconds and helps new people find us when they're searching for relationship education. And we've made it easy. Visit swingeruniversity.com forward slash review. All the instructions are there. Thank you for being part of this community. We'll see you again soon.
