Newbies and Feelings

I think I may have thread cross-over. I was thinking this was the guy that wanted more and she didn't. It's not. This has nothing to do with that. So, at least one of my posts is on the wrong thread.

“until that day comes that your hearing your girlfriend moaning her fool head off while being absolutely drilled by another guy. You're never gonna know how you're gonna feel. At some point you just have to trust in your own ability to handle your emotions.””

+1. This.

All of the on line bull shit matters not at all.

Whatever images and fantasies we may have in our head, dknt matter. Until you go out and do the damn thing, you can’t know how you will react. So, the only reasonable option is to let things play out.

I love these subjects because honestly we aren't really all that seasoned. Sure we have been swinging for 4-5 years and handle it very well but we still occaisionally have "uncomfortable" situations arise. To the OP and I think everyone will agree. You can take things as slow as you want. (As you should) Analyse and discuss every scenario you can imagine. Plot a course of action for every instance. You can do all of those things until your blue in the face (or balls) but until that day comes that your hearing your girlfriend moaning her fool head off while being absolutely drilled by another guy. You're never gonna know how you're gonna feel. At some point you just have to trust in your own ability to handle your emotions.

I think many of you are going off on a tangent here and not giving the op the benefit of doubt. The mention of his girlfriends feelings has been brought up several times. OK that also is a valid concern but this guy seems to be honestly worried about his own feelings. (ahead of time!!!!) Those thoughts should be applauded. I find it refreshing that a guy is putting his possible relationship damaging feelings ahead of his horniness.
Forget the girlfriends feelings for a second. If he decides he's not gonna be able to handle it seeing her with some other guy. Then hopefully for them that will be the end of the lifestyle before it ever got started. At that point her feelings are pretty irrelevent. (doesn't really matter what she thinks about swinging if their not swinging) I give the guy props for putting his brain in front of his dick.

ggmm: Yes, there's every chance that my post has to do with him (the OP) over-ridding his GFs concerns, Even with that, I would like to see them BOTH get what they want. I'm only suggesting to the OP what has worked well for us in hopes that it helps.

There are cases where the LS can bring people closer together as a couple and other times it can bang a stake through their relationship. The OPs post looks like the latter is beginning to happen and I'd not wish that on anyone. Sometimes selfishness is just not knowing any better, and that can potentially be fixed.

Just remember that it is extraordinarily difficult to un-fuck someone. Once you take the leap off the cliff. Well,,, you've taken it. Only you can decide whether to fly off or crash at the bottom.

mayhem, is there any chance this response is to the guy wanting to justify overriding his gf/wife's concern about having FMFs too often? I mean it's kind of tangential to Fun's post, but not to the OP's, if that makes any sense.

"It’s almost as if the OP is looking at this through the lens of someone wanting to fuck other girls and concerned only about how he will feel if it goes both ways."

Well, yeah. I'm guessing there are some who differ, but most guys if you tell them they can fuck other women are all over it. The sticking point is if she wants to fuck other guys. That is somehow a potential problem for some. Hence the starter fantasy of FMFs. While I'm not so cynical as to think every couple who start at or stick with FMFs has an insecure man, I'm pretty convinced that most do. The result seems to be a lot of "bi" women who would really rather have a dick when they want strange, but women is what they get.

On the surface it really seems like a harmless enough question. I could answer it by telling him how many times we play but don't want him to cry..lol

The key thing though is that we BOTH are good with playing as much as we do. There have been times where the Mrs has said she wants a weekend of "just me" time, and I totally respect that.

We get to play as much as we do (aside from opportunity) because each do this for each other. When both parties know there is a vested interest in making the other happy, then both tend to want to do what makes their partner happy.

The point being, it will be WAY more effective for the OP to convince his partner that he is really in it for her rather than try to build a case on the play habits of others,

There are a couple "healthy" reasons that a couple will do FMF only. One reason is that the woman enjoys girl/girl time, which is why I suggested that perhaps he offer that. At the end of the day, I get off on knowing my partner had a good time. This doesn't apply to us as the Mrs isn't into g/g time, but if she was and I didn't get to play with "them", the Mrs would likely show her appreciation in other ways. One of those would be more play time for US if she knew that's what I wanted.

Interesting thread. Two things the OP does not address:

1) How SHE feels about this in terms of wanting to be with another man; and

2) How SHE feels about this in terms of watching her guy with another girl.

It’s almost as if the OP is looking at this through the lens of someone wanting to fuck other girls and concerned only about how he will feel if it goes both ways.

When I participate in discussions like this, I always sound harsh to the people asking the questions. So, let me just say I'm not judging, but I am bluntly assessing your questions and giving the answers my best shot.

"SO, what if we do this and I am really hurt?"

Are you an adult? Do you know how to manage emotional pain without being a burden? If not, don't do it.

"What if I never look at her the same way again?"

Then that makes you a complete asshole. Is that level of douchery in your wheelhouse? Like, are you that intolerant that an activity you both agreed upon changes the way you see her and only her?

"What if it ruin's our relationship?"

It's possible that you could break up over this. But...the fracture points were already there and swinging just accelerated the eventual end.

"If jealousy does appear, how did you all address it and overcome it?"

We talk. And we continue talking until we're sure we've uncovered every single feeling and thought, even the small, mean, ugly ones. Especially the small, mean, ugly ones. We've been doing this a long time, so jealousy isn't something that occurs often, but it does occur. He's less likely to be direct about it, which as a no filters person I find kind of maddening, but he is also less subject to it and saves it for later, which I appreciate. What we usually discover is that one of us needs reassurance in a particular area. In any case, we never adjust what we do to accommodate the jealousy, we just deal with the feelings.

"I'm not convinced I will be upset, I just want to be ready to deal with any untoward emotions that may crop up."

I mean this very kindly, I promise: You'll never be ready.

I guess the best way for me to POSSIBLY help out is to regale our first experience. (sorry this might be long) Several years back Tracy and I started going to a swinger friendly nude campground. We were just nudists at the time but being surrounded by the people and the open conversations about swinging we of course we started talking about it. At that time we didn't know about sls or anything like that so after we decided to give it a try we posted on craigslist. Sure enough we had a somewhat local couple hit us up so we set up a day to meet and hang out by our pond and see where the day led. WE TALKED AT LENGTH about what may or may not happen. We agreed that no matter what happened or how it went down we would NOT discuss it that night and we would NOT hold it against one another. We left all the cards on the table so to speak. We agreed that if we liked that was great. If not. It would be our first and last and would NOT hold it against each other. (you have to have faith in your partner and yourself to hold to this)
As luck would have they showed up and after several beverages filled with courage we proceeded to fuck each others brains out all evening.
They left that night and the next morning Tracy and I experienced an awkward silence while enjoying morning coffee. Finally after several cups and quick weird glances at each other we both almost in unison said. "last night was fuckin fun!" After that we talked at length about the fun. The feelings (or lack there of) . The differences between her/him and us. (sexually) The point is we TALKED! A LOT!! We still do...
Every guy or girl we hook up with we always talk about what happened and how it went down. We give each other a play by play. We are comfortable enough with it that if a guy gets Tracy off better than I can she tells me what he did. I'm not jealous. (I learn) Same goes for her. I once had a lady pull on my balls rather hard. (I LOVED it) I told Tracy about it so now she knows I like that.
I can NOT stress enough to talk! Don't hold back! As I said previously though DO NOT talk about it that night. (ESPECIALLY IF YOUR DRINKING!) Wait until the next day...
Don't worry to much. Some guys are gonna have bigger cocks. Some will have better moves. Some will kiss her or caress her in more sensuous ways than you. Don't be jealous. "Learn".
If you both decide to take the plunge and halfway through your pissed or simply uncomfortable. Just stop it!!! Go home and talk about it TOMORROW! Don't worry about the other couple your with. If they get pissed who cares. Your not living with them.
Like many couples you will come up with a list of rules. I will suggest to rename that as a list of guidelines. (guidelines can be altered, rules are harder). For us our list disintegrated rather quickly. The only RULE we have is no (sleeping/snoozing/waking up next to someone else) Don't take our list as the norm. Tracy and I just do quite well with each other in the lifestyle. Yes at times you will feel UNCOMFORTABLE. Thats pretty much par for the course. At times you will feel a pang of jealousy. Again, par for the course. Try to blow it off but TALK about it the next day. Tell each other what bothered you. BUT DO NOT DO IT THAT NIGHT!
Simply to sum it up.
TALK. TALK. AND TALK. Be TOTALLY HONEST regardless of how petty it may sound. Swinging has no middle ground. It either works or can be a killer.

I see a lot of contradiction in the OP that throws some major red flags.

"I am excited about having "permission" to have sex with another woman, but I am completely unsure of how I would feel seeing/hearing her with another man."

"The Gen X-er in me is having trouble letting go of the monogamous lessons we were taught."

"SO, what if we do this and I am really hurt?"

"What if I never look at her the same way again?"

"What if it ruin's our relationship? If jealousy does appear...………",

Also, I see a lot of "I" with only a few "we's" thrown in.

Definitely enough red flags that I agree, much, much discussion and evaluation needs to occur before going any further with the activity.

"I'll do what make US comfortable"

that is the way to go about this. talk, and then talk some more, about expectations, limits, etc. remember that, even tho you might be with someone bigger, better at certain things, etc., it's just sex, and no one can be better if you love each other

There are so many ways to approach this but they all involve communication, both between you and potential playmates.
First off, you do not need to jump right into full swap. If you did, even if you liked it you would miss out on enjoying all of the baby steps along the way. For example, if you were involved in group sex then a watch/be watched scenario would likely be much less exciting.

There are a number of things you can try, such as strictly watching, watch and be watched, same room/partner, camming online with others, and soft swap (no penetration) to name a few. Each tests for a different response. For example, if you did same room/partner and felt jealous because another guy saw your girl naked, not great but better than having the image of another playing with your GF/wife burned into memory.

Something to also consider are the Pros/Cons of doing something in the context of how it enhances YOUR sex life. In the meantime you need to think about whatever rules you will have for each other and others. For example, it's not uncommon for newbies to be uncomfortable with kissing/cuddling others. You need to know AND communicate these things.

A big hurdle is when you see each other seemingly enjoying themselves MORE with another partner than they do with you. It WILL happen, so how do you deal with that?

Some ramblings that may help from one couple's experiences are:

• Sex and love are two different things and can happen in isolation.

• Sex is basically just a recreational activity.

• Sometimes one person or the other may have a better time at an event.

• If you are both doing this for each other, then you are actually happy for your partner if they had a better time at any given event than you did.

• If each can have sex with whoever they want, there is no good reason to ever cheat.

• A partner that allows you to have sex with others is more reason to stay with that partner.

• For the most part, there is only "different", not better.

• If you enjoy seeing your partner having fun with others, those mental images will enhance your sex life together.

• You will likely learn more ways to please each other from playing with other people.

Talk, talk, and talk some more. I'll add much more tonight when I get home in front of my computer instead of this Itty bitty phone.

You are right, these kind of questions are exactly why we don’t normally play with newbies.

On the other hand, i love the fact that you recognize the importance of talking about this. I had some of the same uncertainties when we first started. I was pretty confident that I would be ok, but acknowledged the idea that my emotional response could not be accurately predicted.

Communication, of course, will be the key. Take baby steps. Stop, talk, repeat.

SO, my gf and I are looking to get into this. We are a bit unique in that we have a large age gap. I am 43, she is 23. The realist in me feels that humans aren't inherently monogamous (see my marriage!) and that some sort of sexual arrangement other than monogamy is a way to more effective relationships. I am not a "poly" guy (at least not right now). I am not a multiple bf/gf kind of guy and I am not a "we get side action from time to time kind of guy." But I think I could become these things with a slow introduction and we think swinging is a way to start. We are already kinky and exploratory; this feels like it makes sense as a logical first step. I am excited about having "permission" to have sex with another woman, but I am completely unsure of how I would feel seeing/hearing her with another man. The Gen X-er in me is having trouble letting go of the monogamous lessons we were taught. SO, what if we do this and I am really hurt? What if I never look at her the same way again? What if it ruin's our relationship? If jealousy does appear, how did you all address it and overcome it?
I'm not convinced I will be upset, I just want to be ready to deal with any untoward emotions that may crop up.

I am sure this is exactly why experienced couples eschew newbies (but, I don't care - I'll do what make US comfortable). But - advice about feelings should they pop up from you experienced folks?