Is Vanilla Marriage Draining Your Soul?

Transcript

Speaker1: In this episode, we're going to talk about the quiet ways relationships die. It's not always cheating, abuse, or betrayal that ends relationships. Sometimes it's boredom, avoidance, and pretending everything's fine. This episode is about the normal-looking relationships falling apart behind closed doors, slowly, quietly, and often with no one noticing. Welcome to Knob Swinging. A raw, real look at modern relationships. I'm Dave Arena. And I'm Victoria Arena. We've been together nearly 30 years, and swinging for more than 22. We're starting this podcast now because for too long, fear kept us from living authentically, from being open about who we are and what our relationship actually looks like. Maybe this is our modern day scarlet letter. But we're here to be both the example and the invitation to help others own their desires and question the scripts we've all been handed. What's broken in today's relationships? Is monogamy even natural for humans? And could the secret to a relationship that doesn't bring your soul B, phoning other people? This show explores how love, sex, and identity often buckle under the weight of societal expectations, especially monogamy. Subscribe to Coming Out Swinging, the podcast that redefines couple goals straight from the motherfucking OGs. Okay, so today we're going to be talking about those relationships that are quietly dying. So the ones that we look at and we're just like, I guess it's the ones that we think Like, how does that even fucking happen? Like, what? Seriously. I don't know. She got the ring. I mean, what do you think that is? Because, like, if you told me, if you told me a 20-year, like, us, like, we've been, not us, because obviously. If you said someone was married for, like, 20 or 30 years, like, I could kind of get that. Like, okay. Like, things just, like, petered out. But, like, after a year or two, like, you're in the honeymoon. Yeah, I don't know. I can't really answer that. You can't even answer that from a... You can't even... I always think... This is horrible. I always think that's a female issue, which absolutely... That is horrible, because you don't know that. You don't know that. But I always think, like, what guy is getting married? Maybe I shouldn't say that, because I guess guys lose interest too, but like... Well, you would think... From a female... I guess what I'm trying to ask you from a female perspective... Let me just paint the picture, though. Two years in, it might be, like, baby-making time. And so if it's always planned or if she's always... How are you making babies if you're not having... What I'm saying is he might not be into that. So he's, like, putting it off. That's why I'm trying to make this on the girl. Like, the guy's not interested because it's always, like, you know, she's checking her temperature or some shit. I don't know. No, you're right. It could be anything. That they just stop having sex because they don't want to schedule it. Or, and this is even more horrible, but we know this is reality is that some guys like say after the baby or during the baby like they lose some of that magical like they lose attraction yeah because of because now she's wearing sweatpants every day right or maybe she didn't lose a little bit of the pregnancy weight or what yeah that's so sad but we've heard that we've literally heard that have we not we have we've heard we've actually had people say that that's why we have friends that their spouse told them that which is just blows my mind that you would yeah i wanted to smack him it blows my mind that you would even think that or like i've never thought that and she was hot and we've gone through three pregnancies we've both gone through crazy weight gains and losses just outside of pregnancy both of us right and i never once lost any attraction or but even if you thought that like to say it out loud is like I mean, it could just be the old factor of it just gets mundane and they're just not into it anymore. After one or two years? Yeah, because maybe they were doing it like rabbits before they got even married. Come on. If it's just going through the motions and it's not exciting, think about it. Okay. Well, you're talking my language now because that's our whole thing is like making things exciting. Right. Like, so if it's just she's just going to lay there or he's just going to lay there and she's got to do all the work. Either way, it can become just mundane. I don't know. That's, I mean, but isn't that a huge red flag like that early on? Of course. Like that early? Of course. You're in trouble. Yeah. Big S red flag. And that's what we're talking like. We're not talking about like, I mean, sometimes it may be the case, but we're typically not talking about like cheating or explosive fighting. It's just like a complete loss of physical connection, like right off the bat. But I mean, that's crazy to me. I mean, what do you. So this is where our solution would be like, well, maybe you should try the lifestyle. Maybe you should try swinging to get that spark back. Right. It'd be hot. Like, imagine, I like to tell people that a lot. Like, I'm like, if they, what's wrong with just going in, like, watching it one night, just go watch. But we did that episode about that, right? Yeah. Where it's like, if you're gonna go home and fuck like rabbits, it's gonna be great. Right. Because let's just say their relationship was okay otherwise, and they just needed that spark. I still feel like is there something else like why I don't know maybe that's a question for you especially as a woman do you think that that's is that a red flag in terms of like this relationship is in trouble because we should be still physically attracted or do you think that or do you think that it could just be a phase that you can get out of or do you think there's something fundamentally wrong under the surface that's causing that here it's just gonna go down to one word again communication and I'll tell you why? They could dig themselves out of it if they talked about it. Most of these couples don't want to talk about anything. Why? I have no idea. But they don't want to talk to each other about anything. So they don't want to talk to each other about the finances. They don't want to talk to each other about the kids. They don't want to talk to each other about their boredom. They don't want to talk to each other about sex. It becomes a huge thing. It's always communication. And that's got to be like a big elephant in the room all the time if you're not like physically Intimate, especially that early on. Exactly. So you got to talk about the elephant in the room. Exactly. But they don't. No. Although some do, because the reason we even brought this up is because we knew a couple that actually had no problem coming out and saying that. And I was like, what? I remember when we were in the car on the way home, I'm like, how does that even happen? Yeah. I just don't get it, especially that early on. It just doesn't make any sense. Right. one group. But I mean, I think the other thing is then you've got. So that's like the early on. I think you're right. It's like either the honeymoon phase is just gone. Right. They they're settling down into normal life. Maybe they are still in that or they are in that baby mode. Right. But then there's like that next phase, which is like I call it like you're married to the calendar, not each other. Like that's when like the kids are the kids. Yeah. When they're when you're living for your children. only. Yeah. Why don't you, you have that joke. That's like my favorite joke in your standup. Right. Where it's like, we came first. Yeah. Like, you know, if the boat was sinking. Right. So if like the boat was sinking and you could only save your wife or your children, I would, it's easy for me. I would save my wife. And especially like people just don't want to hear that because they're all about their kids. You know what I mean? And they just stroke out when I say that. And I'm like, well, you know, If your wife came first, we can make more kids. It's true, though. It's so true. It's so bad, but it's so true. Well, we've always put each other first, and I think that that's also healthy to show your kids. Absolutely. I would want my girls, you know, to pick their partner based on, you know, the loving relationship that they saw their parents have. Yeah, and we're not saying that life doesn't get in the way sometimes, and you don't do things for your kids, and you don't, you know. But what I'm talking about is where they just seem like their co-parents living in the same house. And they're just like logistic scheduling partners. And it's just they're just on the go all the time. And it's all about the kids. And it's like if you observe couples that are like that, at least I feel this way. I don't know if you feel the same way. When I observe couples like that, I feel like it's like it feels to me like they don't even realize that life is just a blur and just feels like that. flashing by. Yeah. And then what are you going to do when those kids are finally out of the house? You don't even know each other anymore. Right. And that's something we never we never wanted to lose that connection because it's like you are going to be by yourself again. The kids are going to be gone. We personally know one particular couple and they are calendar parents, like calendar couple. Yeah. And like everything is built around. these kids, you know, just the, you know, I, anytime you, you say, Hey, you know what, whatever it's another sporting event or it's another school choir or school actor, school activity, you know, whatever it is, it's just like 19,000 things on their calendar a week. And you're just ships sailing by in the night. Yeah. Yeah. Just like not, I just, I really worry for that particular couple. when those kids are not in the house anymore. Because I don't know how they're going to recover and come back to each other. Reconnect. Because I just feel like I don't see. It's not that I don't see love. I think they love each other. It's not like I don't see. It's more the intimacy and the connection. Yeah, I don't see that. Now, we don't necessarily know what happens behind closed doors. They can be completely fine. They can be freaks. what they're doing. Like, I don't know. Right. It's just, I just find it hard to believe just with where the energy is going. Yeah. And this isn't just about, because we could be wrong about any one particular couple. But you see this a lot as, like, people will relate to what we're talking about, because you see those couples all the time, where they're just on the go, on the go, all about their kids, up their kids' ass. First of all, you don't need to be up your kids' ass that much. Like, let them have some independence, but whatever. That's a whole nother, that's probably a whole nother podcast. True. But, yeah, I just, I feel the same way. Like, when you see a lot of divorces happen that way, where after the kid, when they're empty. Those are the scariest ones to me. Yeah, because when they're empty. Because it's like, they've been together for 25 years, and then, bam, they're getting divorced. Those are sad, eerie divorces to me. Yeah. They really are. But not. But not, not surprising. Not, yeah, it's not surprising when you, if you were observing their lifestyle. Because that's gotta be, yeah, super hard. And you all, we've had this, we've had this discussion before. And I think it also goes back to the original, the honeymoon phase couple. Is there something fundamentally wrong before all this? Like, in other words, a chicken and egg situation. Is the living for your kids and doing all this the cause of it? Or was there already a problem and you just threw your yourself into the kids to make it work and be like, well, this will distract us from us. Good question, huh? Yeah, that is a good question. I mean, I can't answer that. But yeah, I don't know. I almost always believe that there's an underlying problem first. I almost always believe that there is something that was fundamentally wrong that caused you to go in that direction because that's because we never had that issue because we didn't prioritize it and we didn't have any reason to like go in that direction. Yeah. Do you get what I'm saying? Yeah. I mean, we're getting into some deep shit now. Whoa. But that's why I always say it's a red flag, right? Because you didn't really agree as much with the honeymoon phase situation because you're like, yeah, things can just happen and whatever. But I always look at it like, well, how do you even get to that point? What's going on there? Maybe it's just because we never had those issues. Yeah. Maybe it's because we didn't do shit with our kids. Yeah. I feel bad about that. Then you have those people like they're just, I think they're just bored with each other. I mean, personally, they might not know they're bored with each other, but they literally, like, they could be in the same room and not say two words to each other. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, and try and justify it. We know a couple like that. Yeah, it's, I mean, I think you just need to prioritize the relationship however you need to. I know it sounds corny, but, like, having those date nights and doing things out there, outside of the day-to-day stuff and the kids. Yeah. I know it sounds corner like, oh, we do a date night. But I mean, you know, we've always done that. We've always prioritized each other first and then hope that that trickles down to the kids as lessons. And it's not like we're, I don't want to say, it's not like we neglected the kids. No. Our kids had a great freaking life. Don't get me wrong. Yeah. I'm just saying in general, you know. And it's like you said, too, like, it's scary. when you hear, not scary, but, I mean, you use the word scary. I think it's always sad when you hear the 25-year marriage ending. But I think it's also because we internalize that to our own relationships. So we think, man, I couldn't, I think the scary part is you internalize them and think, man, is there something that I'm not seeing here that I don't know that all of a sudden everything can seem happy for 25 years? Yes, there might be some situations like that, but I really do think it's a slow erosion. I think there's signs and there's things like we're talking about that if you really look back on it, you're like, not so surprising. Like, sometimes we hear it with certain couples and we are surprised at first, but probably not if you examined their everyday life. Exactly. You know what I mean? Yeah, totally. You know, I think a close, I was going to say close cousin, but maybe not to the, maybe they're, I don't know, you probably would think they're totally different situations, is the people that have the whole illusion of being perfect. Especially now that we have social media, you see it all the time. Yeah. Like. Well, I would say that that's a majority of the people on social media. I struggle with this one because we do put up some corny shit or like when it's our anniversary but I feel like A. we don't do it as much as we used to and B. it usually is here and there like either an anniversary or when I'm thinking about something or a memory comes up or a hot picture of me yeah but I I mean I guess there's two different things we're talking about here right one of them is the perfect like oh we're gonna put up the family pictures and make it look like everything's rosy. Not that there's anything about people that do it to where it's, like, nauseating. And then there's also the people that go way overboard with, like, the love quotes and the, oh, you're my world. And I think we even talked about that one story earlier. Yeah, he was a weirdo. But you see people do that all the time where it's, like, you can sniff out the authenticity. Like, you could sniff out the ones that are, like... Oh, they are cute together. Yeah, like, I can... I'm babbling here because I'm struggling. I'm struggling with the fact that sometimes it's okay and sometimes it's not and you just need to know the people so like if you saw certain couples that we love as couples do that same behavior you'd be like aww they are like the greatest they are cute they're so cute right and then the other people could do the same exact thing and you're like why are you hatering on those people because you just know those people are annoying and they're full of shit Because that's not really how it is. Right. You get what I'm saying? I'm not stupid. You're not really like that. Right. So that's why I'm struggling. Because it's not that all of it's bad. Because some people may listen to this and be like, well, we do that. We post stuff about each other. And it's like, well, if you're not one of the annoying, full of shit people, then you're fine. Like, there's some people that were just like, uh. It's just pretend. It's just for show. Like, inspirational captions. It's so funny because in my head I pictured the, oh, they are really cute. cute together couple and then when you said that I was like bleh like no I know that couple I just don't want there to be any I just want to be clear that there are just occasion there are people that can if you're authentic about it it shows and if you're not it'll it'll keep right through yeah so I don't know I guess to wrap it up it's not always drama right it's not always it's not always There's been plenty of couples where we're like, that was not surprising at all, that they broke up after one year or after 10 years. Yeah, it's so amazing to me to sit here and go, the ones that are the seven-year-ish couples that end it, it's usually never surprising. Right. Kind of saw it coming, you know, whatever else. The ones that are the 25-year ones, technically not surprising, but really super sad because you just felt like they wanted to make it work. We, you know, we wanted it to work for them or maybe, you know, or you are surprised after 25 years that it was them one or the other. It's just, you know, it's quite telling, I guess you could say. Yeah. And I based on the amount of years. And like I said, if you look, if you really look at those people that you're kind of surprised by, maybe it's not so surprising. But the point is, it's not always those very volatile, like, yep, saw that coming from a Sometimes it is, you can see it, but it's still kind of surprising because it's that slow burn. It's that slow decay over time. You know what I mean? And that's what we're talking about. They aren't even necessarily toxic couples. They're just like neglected or disconnected or just emotionally not there. Yeah. And it's, I guess we'll challenge the audience, right? Like we were just saying, are you one of those annoying people? Are you not? But no, like, are you truly are you addressing problems or just keeping up appearances? Like you like to say, like are you communicating about this stuff? And I think our biggest one, right, is are you, when we see this all the time, like are you just roommates or are you actually lovers? You know what I mean? Yeah, flat out. I didn't even get that word lovers. Lovers just gives me, and I laugh because it reminds me of that sketch. It kind of sounds icky when you say it. It reminds me of that sketch with, The Lovers. Yeah. With the... It's my funniest... It's the funniest... One of my favorites with Rachel Dratch and Will Ferrell in the hot tub. Yeah. Or the one they had Jimmy on. Yeah. Barrymore, that was a great... Anyhow, we're off on a tangent, but that's what I... I'm not gonna lie. I tripped up on Lovers. When you say Lovers. Yes, Lovers. Are you Lovers? It just sounds... Are Lovers. There you go. I'd give you one. Are you just being roommates and not, you know, Doing the thing. Not connecting. Exactly. We'll see you next time. If you're digging this, make sure to subscribe. Leave us a review and follow us on TikTok at Dick and Dave. We'd love to help you redefine couple goals through non-monogamy without the mess. New episodes every week. We'll see you next time.