How Swinging Made Our Marriage Bulletproof

Transcript

Speaker1: You know, a lot of couples may try swinging once or for a short period of time. So what made us keep going and keep growing for 22 years? In this episode, we share the real reasons we stayed in the lifestyle, from the electric excitement to the deep, unexpected communication breakthroughs swinging created. We also talk about how swinging gave us new ways to keep things fun, adventurous, and even a little competitive, while our monogamous friends stayed stuck in miserable, disconnected relationships. If you've ever wondered what swinging can really add to a strong relationship, this is the episode that spells it out. Welcome to Coming Out Swinging. A raw, real look at modern relationships. I'm Dave Arena. And I'm Victoria Arena. We've been together nearly 30 years, married over 24, and swinging for more than 22. We're starting this podcast now because for too long, fear kept us from living authentically, from being open about who we are and what our relationship actually looks like. Maybe this is our modern day scarlet letter. But we're here to be both the example and the invitation to help others own their desires and question the scripts we've all been handed. What's broken in today's relationships? Is monogamy even natural for humans? And could the secret to a relationship that doesn't drain your soul be owning other people? This show explores how love, sex, and identity often buckle under the weight of societal expectations, especially monogamy. Subscribe to Coming Out Swinging, the podcast that redefines couple goals straight from the motherfucking OGs. Okay, so today we're going to talk about kind of the four big reasons we kept swinging for all these years. Yes. Because we see a lot of people come and go. We really do. We see people that try it like once and we've never seen them again. Yeah. Or we've seen people come and they just watch every time like i mean that's fine too but like what i'm saying is like they just a lot of people disappear from this world yeah either one time and they're done yeah or just a short period of time yeah which is understandable i get that but i think the first reason really for us is the excitement. Oh, absolutely. Like no matter how many years go by, there's always a spark. Yeah. It's always spicy. It's always, um, it's not mundane. it's not like you know like i hear stories of couples that say things like, oh, it's a chore. I have to go down on them. I have to do, you know, like, like that stuff blows my mind. I just don't understand it. Why connecting with your partner is a chore. Like, I really can't ever wrap my mind about it. So to know that we have this extra like sex toy, basically, that's what this, you know, in my mind, that's the best scenario to explain keeps us going. Like it's so it's fun. It's spicy. We always ask each other if we think we need this at this point. And I, we always say no, but I'm almost wondering, like, do you think we do? I mean, we always have had a good sex life. Although I will say most of our marriage has been in the lifestyle, but, but even before that we had a good sex life and things have always been exciting, even when it's you and I, but I don't know. I think a big part of our excitement and our even because it's become part of our social life, too, like us going out. Yes. I mean, maybe we're being a little Delulu saying, like, we don't need it. I don't know that we need it. I do believe we both want it. Yeah. Like, I couldn't imagine. Cutting this out of my social. Right. And doing vanilla shit, like whatever that is. Yeah. Like, what are we going want it yeah like i couldn't imagine cutting this out of my social right and doing vanilla shit like whatever that is yeah like what are we gonna do like paint and sip or whatever sip and paint sip and paint on a friday night i don't know what the hell we'd be doing yeah like i that's just not us yeah it's i mean for us i think this makes it also just never routine. Correct, yes. And the intimacy stays playful, alive. I think there's an adrenaline rush as well to it. Oh, yeah, absolutely. And I think sometimes when it's like a scenario that's out of character, for me, like that, well well we always know that that's just hot for you anyways but like it just it it whatever you can create in that that night or that moment or that whenever we play I don't know we've played day and nights I can't really say it. Um, you know, it just makes everything more um energizing yeah you know there's no lag and i think the excitement part of it is why we even evolve to what we evolve to in terms of how we play like again and we've said this on previous episodes where we don't look to communicate a lot and meet people and go out and feel them out and have a connection correct we basically post up at a club or an event or something where it's a night out for us no matter what yes and we also will play in the open with just you and I starting no matter what and I mean unless in the rare case we we hit it off with someone right off the bat and we right we end up Thank you. Also, we'll play in the open with just you and I starting no matter what. And I mean, unless in the rare case, we hit it off with someone right off the bat and we end up being with, you know, someone. But typically we will start just you and I in the open and then whatever happens happens because we want that spontaneous, you know, we just want whatever happens in the moment happens happens and what's funny about that is you like seeing how you have evolved specifically especially since you were so self-conscious and still so oh yes we all we all are very self-conscious as a woman right and and you never would do anything out in the open and no in the beginning i was like hell no we are closing a woman. Right. And, and you never would do anything out in the open. And no, in the beginning, I was like, hell no, we are closing a door, locking it. Like, you know, they can listen. Like, that's how it was in the beginning. And I was like, yeah, it was. And we also would do like couples only at some point. And then we just, you know, but again, we evolved based on the excitement factor. We evolved where we're like, ooh, like, what if that is exciting if a single guy like just came in or, you know, and then it got to the point where today we literally just start with each other and then whatever happens in the moment happens. Yeah, I think a big thing for us was, and not to put you off, but like, I think a big thing for us early on was observation so like you know you go to these clubs or parties or whatever and you're observing what's happening around you and then you take that scenario home that maybe you didn't try right yeah and we have pillow talk about it because we thought it was hot what we saw yeah and then we're like well would you try you know would you let me try that would you you know would that be hot you know, would that be hot? You know, or maybe we should try that, you know, that kind of thing. And I remember slowly starting to keep the door cracked open. And then, you know, a single guy would come over and push it open because, you know, they push boundaries and they push it open. And you get so pissed off. Oh, I would get so pissed off. Don't touch my door. Yeah. Then you wanted the chain up. For those that don't know, if you put the chain across the door, you can keep the door open and put the chain across and they can watch, but they can't come in. And anytime I tried to push the boundaries and like, leave it, I'd like, try to be slick and leave it off. And you'd be like, put that chain up like, I would freak out. Yeah, right. So just slowly evolved to where what we do today is, I mean, of course, the club here that we go to is all open. there is no there are no rooms so um but yeah it's just funny but that what you said about observation no what you said about coming home and talking about it leads kind of into the second reason yeah why we've kept in the lifestyle which is the deeper communication which actually surprised us. It surprised us, I think, in two cents. And you let me know your thoughts on this. One, I think it was just the fact that we were able to find out a lot more about what each other liked. And that evolves too, right? Or what we thought was exciting what we were into sexually correct yes way more than we probably ever would have but then it also just allowed us to communicate more deeply on just all sorts of levels because I think I don't know there's something weird about the sexual stuff like if you can talk about that stuff you can really talk about anything i completely agree i think i don't understand people who can't communicate their desires like i i mean it happens every day and i just can't wrap my head around it but like i don't know how that's healthy so you're just gonna stay miserable and meh because you can't you don't want to say what you desire or and it that's literally all it is it doesn't mean you're going out and acting like even if you don't try swimming ever or you don't try these adventurous things ever why can't you just talk about it behind your your closed door yeah like you said about like the example you gave of like uh oh i gotta go down on you or whatever it's almost like it becomes a duty or like a like a chore right like you're just doing it just uh every once in a while because that's what you're supposed to do and how does that make your partner feel you know what i mean and likewise guy on girl girl on guy you know like it just like i don't understand that yeah i think also nothing was really off limits anymore and again this goes back to what we were saying about even guys where you felt you had to hide porn or you had to hide this, you had to wall off this portion of you. Right. Because that wasn't something you could talk about with your spouse. So I think just the note, the shame and the no secrets and the no taboos. And I mean, we about some it was funny we were on a podcast yeah and they actually told us they're like yeah you guys like we want some juicy details like we actually don't you actually aren't that explicit on your podcast and i thought i'm like i wonder if like we should be like is that like something that we're missing out on? But like, we have not, like we talk, we talk in pillow talk a lot about a lot of things that we were like, whoa, like I didn't like, there's been times where you were even like afterwards, you're like, I didn't know how you would react if I said that. But what, because in the moment you said whatever. Yeah. And I, I mean, I don't know if you have any examples or anything you want to share if you're too like, well, are we too closed up with the stuff? No, I mean, there we've definitely pushed the boundary over the years. I think one of the hottest things I ever did with you was so we had gone like on a Friday night. So the club in New York City city was open friday and saturday well they're open all the time but like we went friday this particular weekend we went friday night and you know when i went i i'm the woman i got the i got a lot of attention and you know the workers would tease dave of you know vick's gonna get the attention or or Vic always gets hers or, you know, whatever. It's it's harder for a guy to meet like a woman or me to even feel like a woman's not a cray cray. And there was a woman I was at the bar with my friend and we were, you know, having a couple of drinks. And she's like, God, Dave's talking to that girl in the corner. And I thought to myself, Dave's talking to a girl? Like, what? And I remember looking over my shoulder. I have no game at all. You're my wing woman. Which is another thing we're talking about here, right? With the communication. Yeah. If I was a single guy in this thing, I'd do nothing. Oh, yeah. You'd be dead in this world. Yeah. You're a good wing woman. Yeah. Which, again, how many people could say that about their wife? Yeah. And she was cute. She was, you know, you guys just talked. I don't think it was anything, you know, interesting happening, like, when you were there or whatever. Well, she took, I could definitely tell she was interested and she wanted, she asked to sit by me. And then also, as you know, when there's a single female, a lot of single guys were just going crazy. Yeah, they were circling her like piranhas. She was kind of freaked out a little bit. So I think I was like, again, a safe haven, safe on my phone. Yeah. So I think I, you know, went back to my socializing or whatever. And then I said, there's a bed up there. And they were like, Dave's on the bed with the girl. And I was like, what? shoulder but it didn't bother me and i was just like hey dave's doing his thing i always get my you know like this is great it was hot it was super hot well then well then then no after that so then the owner of the club who you're friends with was like he's fucking that girl on on the couch. And you were like, I can't, because, and it was so surprising because I never make a move like that, but it happened so organically. And because you set it up initially, meaning you sent her kind of over to talk. I knew, I just know, but okay. So this is the level of communication we're talking about I know that if you want something to happen and you set it up and this is also plays into the competitive part that we talked about at the opening yeah you're competitive in the sense that everyone's gawking about this single female that comes in and wants to, you know, you are like, I'm going to make this happen with my husband and she's going to have a good time. Correct. So when I know you're in that mode, when I got the if I got the opportunity and I didn't do it, you would have kicked my ass. Yeah, I would have been like, you are so lame. Like why? So, you know, that happened. So I remember going over and sitting and watching and like the whole thing was just like hot, you know, and you kind of just went into a zone. It was great. And then afterwards we, we talked to her for a while and she was like, so I have a, I remember her small story. She was in for a wedding for a friend and she had like some stuff Thank you. afterwards we, we talked to her for a while and she was like, so I have a, I remember her small story. She was in for a wedding for a friend and she had like some stuff the next day, like, you know, like early wedding or something. And she's like, maybe I'll come back. And I said, well, here's my number. I, we, we always do women. You know, I usually do the communicating outside. And I remember exchanging with her. It wasn't until like 10 o'clock, nine 30, 10 o'clock the next night. And she texted us and said, are you guys at the club? And we said, no, we just hung inside because we didn't hear from her by 10 o'clock. You didn't think anything, you know? And she was like, Oh, I, I, that's sad. I thought about going back up there tonight. And, um, I said, Oh, well, where are you staying? You know, that know that kind of thing I said and I remember just because talking to her the night before we found out that her thing was married guys like that was her turn on yeah a guy with a ring and that I was so open she was like that's cool so I remember saying to her just out of the clear blue I think Dave almost fell the chair he was sitting on. And I said, how about I send Dave to you? And she was like, what? You would do that? And I said, sure, I don't even need to come. And we've never done anything like this, ever. You have. I have, yeah. Especially like a hotel takeover or whatever. I've gone to like somebody's hotel room like the next morning while I'm just chilling. Yeah. But me never like. No. Yeah. And, you know, I said she goes, oh, well, what are your rules? And I just gave her like like I mean, I think my rule was like you had to be home by two. Like I didn't want you out past two really in New Yorkork city like i just i don't know i was just in my head like i just gave a time and um i wanted like one or two like a little short snippet of a video or something sexy for me to see that you guys did and i think that might have been it i don't even think i gave a third no that you said the I had to be home yeah and i think that might have been it i don't even think i gave a third no that you said the i had to be home yeah you had to be home and yeah the video the video yeah it was so funny because i was in the i jumped in the shower before and i literally kept saying like i kept calling out to you like are you sure about this like i'm like i remember even in the uber i was like um are you still sure because i literally would have just turned around turned around again back to communication right if there was any inkling of like i don't think i ever wavered that night no i was cool as a cucumber yeah and it was so hot and then obviously was hot and then obviously we were able to to reconnect and that was but that's an example of an evolution of something we had never done never thought that would happen and it just yeah it was super hot was so exciting and then you know we do things like of course i'm usually the one pushing the envelope i, more, because I have these visions in my head where it's like, we just go through these phases, right? We go through these phases where I'm like, well, what if the guy's just like, like, you put your ass up in the air, you're blowing me, and then they just rub themselves on you, your ass like an ass job type of thing and then because you like when guys come on you yeah i have a confetti especially not in me on me on you especially on your ass yeah so i was like well what if guys just kind of got behind you and like that's what we told them they could do but then some would try to push the envelope a little bit or you they could tell that you were kind of into you know so it's like all these sometimes i'm like i i like reach over because like i'm like really into it like whatever's happening in the moment and then like i slide the guy the condom yeah and i would and the guy gets like you could tell he's like holy shit i'm gonna get to i'm gonna get to fuck her now you know what's weird what's weird is that like i have to have it go a certain way where they almost don't know they don't know what if they can go further yeah and that tension is the excitement for me and then sometimes you'll speak you'll be like oh you can fuck me and I'm like you just ruined the whole like that just that threw me out of the moment but it's like that those kind of scenarios like we just come up with these different things I don't know if you could think of any other no I mean not right off the top of my head but like those are kind of the ones I mean like and it's not a game it's not a game because it really does take me out too like i have to really be into it and vibing with it for to you know like to go that way um so yeah it's not like it's you know it doesn't become a chore we keep it spicy yeah and we keep the point is we always are communicating and we always come up with these scenarios like you said either something we've seen other people do or something we just kind of come up with and we're like yeah what if we tried that or what if we did one of the things i thought more recently actually which we don't really do very often even though we say we go upstairs and kind of start our own thing or whatever one of the things that I'm finding really hot nowadays is the starting on the couch play and you know like finger play and you know oral play like right there on the couch where people are just like standing over you watching. And we saw a couple doing it and we were like, so turned on by them. Yeah. And lately that's just kind of been like a thing. Like we've wanted to like, you know, uh, or the horse I'll, I'll like go over the horse, like so that my ass is like over the horse and stuff. And I think those have been like super hot because then we're not like laying down on a bed for two hours just you know mundane we do we have had people go my god he fucks her forever well we do that because we don't know what the hot situation of the night is going to be sometimes yeah people don't know what our deal is yeah and dave does have stamina so we like you know, you know, it's just sometimes it's just like, that's just the way it's going to go. So I think now, like, we've been breaking it up and taking breaks, maybe going down and having another drink. Like, we don't mind even getting dressed again and going back downstairs. Most people that say that they don't understand that we're doing that. We're starting with each other and we're doing things so that, mostly single guys let's be honest yeah that's our thing we'll come up and either ask or start you know engaging yeah that's why we do that for so long it's like we're trying to just have it happen organically exactly and not a playbook yeah right not a conversation for hours correct um you know I think also too and this is gonna sound shitty probably but I don't really care I feel like the fourth reason I mean so we've already gone over kind of the excitement the deeper communication the endless new things to try like we just yeah I think the fourth big key of why we've kept doing this is I feel like I think you'll understand what I'm talking about I feel like we're one upping the average vanilla relationship I completely agree with you I know that sounds shitty, but you alluded to it when you said, you know, about vanilla relationships and it being a duty and, you know, but we see all sorts of shit where it's just like, you guys are miserable and I just don't see the intimacy. I don't see the connection. I don't see the communication. I't see the connection I don't see the communication I just see two people living together right and having a lot of times you know kids or jobs and just going through the mundane way of life and you bring this up all the time it's a silly example but like it really is a great example where you know if, if we're out somewhere, you have no problem saying, oh, that dude's hot or you'll pick out a woman and be like, did you see that? And of course, I'm usually oblivious. And this is everything. Right. But you'll point it out. I've even had like on Instagram where you'll just like follow different like models that that you're like, oh, she's thick. Like, you'd like her, you know, I'm like, I would have never, you know, put that on my, like, social media. At one point you were like, why are you putting all these plus size models on my... Right. But I'm just saying, as silly as that may sound, compared to most couples where you're either going to get smacked in the head if you if you turn your head at another chick yeah or you're constantly like not trusting each other and trying to break into their phone or check their phone while you know what i mean like we don't have any of those no none concerns or worries you know what i mean and i just i really don't like i I don't have any way that i lean where it's a non-trust with you in this world i trust you with all my everything my safety my feelings huge like if i felt like one minute like dave we we pushed the envelope too far. You would hear me out and we'd fix it. But like, we've never had that. We've never even had to do that because the communication is so open for us. Yeah. But there have been times where you're like either not into something as much as, as much as I had it in my head or, or you were like, I don't really, but again, I, you you brought up the safety too like that's what really deepens the level of trust and the communication again is because there is more at stake than just you know there are other aspects when you're doing this like safety and and trust and also just what do you like and what don't you like? And, oh, that, or that didn't sit well with me, or I didn't really like that you did that or whatever. I mean, again, we don't really have, I can't really think of any examples that I know most, mostly our things are the, like I mostly with you and I, it's you not liking or not being into something as much as I may be into it. Like I've all come up with an idea and you'll be like, no. Yeah. And I'll tell you what, Thank you. you not liking or not being into something as much as I may be into it. Like I've all come up with an idea and you'll be like, no. Yeah. And I'll tell you what, there are all walks of life that come through those doors when they get a paycheck of single men. And I got to be wooed a little bit. Like I'm not into like the, the ripped sweatpants and the t-shirt and the, like've got to be clean groomed smell good and there's times where dave's tried to push the envelope and he's like oh just come on you know like he just wants no i'm not i'm not touching him and i and i get it i get it when you tell me you know but again you have that's why communication is so important absolutely when you communicate that i'm like i get it i get what you're saying and you understand you even understand where i'm coming from you're like i get the fact that you're eager beaver and you're getting excited about what's in your mind and to double up on that there's been guys that i'm into and then they get up close and i'm like i can't i don't know what's going on or they plowed through 10 women already. Yeah. Oh, that one drives me nuts. If I've seen you go through, first of all, some of these clubs, some of the way we'll talk about this another time. But there's a way to look and present yourself at a club as well. Some of the time, if I've seen what you've gone through already and then you want to come to me, have a standard of myself I dress the part I look the part I you know I and I don't walk around like the gum on the bottom of your shoe you're gonna you're gonna want to be with me you know what I mean I that's just the way I I feel in my head but that's also I have that confidence but your thing, too. You like to be chaste. You like to be. Yeah. You like to be. So I saw you go through that and you want to come over to me now. Hell no. Right. You're like, I'm not just another one. No way. Yeah, for sure. Even though we all know what we're there for. It's just. Absolutely. For you, it's a. It's a little. That's where the competitive in me gets a little bit more, you know. Yeah. So, yeah. So I think I think between those, you know, those are really the big things that have really kept us going for any couples out there who wonder, you know, if swinging is just a phase for some people, it is right. For some people, it is just or it's not their thing. Right. They do try it or they check it out. It's just not their thing. But I think that they respectively tried it and then said you know just wasn't for us yeah but i think that's why for us it hasn't faded out or gotten old or anything you know what i mean right and i think to go back on the very first question do we need this i don't think we need it i think we want it i think we like it um and it's been so ingrained in our yeah life yeah absolutely that's what we do to go not that that's the only thing we do but like and we don't do it like people are like oh do you do it every week we could but we don't like you know like most weeks most weeks but like you know it's not but we do other things we do do other things yeah we do go to dinners and meet with friends and you know i have i have a everybody who knows me knows i'm a social princess anyway so like it's not you know yeah uh this is not i can go without it yeah and we'll still have great sex at home yeah i think i would get more crabby than you probably just because of the again i think a lot of guys it's. It's the, it's the what's in my mind. You know what I mean? Yeah, I agree with you. All right. Well, I think that'll wrap it up for this episode. We will see you next time. If you're digging this, make sure to subscribe, leave us a review and follow us on TikTok at Dick and Dave. We'd love to help you redefine couple goals through non-monogamy without the mess. New episodes every week. We'll see you next time.