THE WALL

@Marion

Legal immigration - you realize asylum seekers are legal immigrants. All you are arguing is if they came in the front door or side door. Remember, there have been laws about just being on the soil, doesn't matter the entry point. Asylum is asylum. So you are for all the people at the border or are you saying that they have to come in the front door? If so, you OK with getting rid of metering?

I am curious why you are trying to protect 'our' way of life so much. If they bring peace, that would not be our way of life and you would not want that? 'Our way of life,' differs from region to region.

TopGolf is not a golf course. It is a social event at a driving range basically. The reason for the increased price is not cost of living. It is cost of land. An acre of land in LA, hell depending where it is at, could go for 20 to 80mm. An acre of land in Hunstville, well, I see a 6 acre lot for 995 for sale right now and a 2 acre lot for 2mm in a Publix shopping mall.

EA What are you going to say or do when all these military age men that are crossing our border, with help from our government start killing people and burning shit down? If you even had a clue, you would know there are many many sleeper cells just waiting for the go. You can bet your ass its coming. Kinda brings me back to " Those who know, Know.

Mickey

legal immigration peoples who desire to become permanent residents of the U.S. and conform to our laws and way of life. Not people seeking refuge from a situation they (in part or whole) created in their country of origin & wish to bring the same way of life with them, undermining the way of life we now enjoy.

For the record.

1: I'm from El Paso Texas originally, I've lived all over & I got used to unsweeten in basic.

2: I've never touched a golf club, IMO a golf course is a willfull misuse of a perfectly good rifle range.

3: to address your earlier question, I'm all for legal immigration of any color, nationality or race.

4: to address your most recent inquiry, probably because of cost of living. Which is why $14.00/hr cash isn't a bad wage in rural Alabama.

@Marion

Dude.

Hand it over.

You lost your Southerner Card.

Next thing you are gonna say is that you don't like cornbread, or grits.

Are you one of those KALE eating people?

BTW, here is an interesting perspective for you. TopGolf in Huntsville is $56 an hour at peak time. TopGolf in LA is $75 an hour at peak time. Can you tell me why?

@EA: I drink unsweetened tea w no artificial cancer powder.

@Marion

So you don't want them here because they don't speak English?

So you don't want them here because they are not from 'Murica?

So you don't want them here because they are Latin?

So you don't want them here because they are African?

So you don't want them here because they are Chinese?

So you don't want them here because they are from India?

As a southerner, I understand that tea is 10 parts sugar, 1 part tea. I have learned from being in China that there are different teas, not the cracker barrel versions. It is enlightening to learn that there are other things in the world. Why people don't want that, confuses me.

I don't want them here. For all the aforementioned reasons.

@Marion

"how exactly does one "go after" Juan Jose Rodriguez, who speaks no English and has no ID , for those unpaid bills, tickets, etc?"

Are you a cat or a squirrel? Why? Because you are focusing on something that is already in place but ignoring the bigger picture. kff. org/uninsured/issue-brief/sources-of-payment-for-uncompensated-care-for-the-uninsured/

How many 2500 bills does it take to get to the billions of fraud that Rick Scott did while at HCA to the government?

At what point will you, and those against immigration just admit that you are reaching for things that have no basis in fact and just say, "I don't want them here."

Oh wait. You and I are paying that tab as well.

“how exactly does one "go after" Juan Jose Rodriguez, who speaks no English and has no ID , for those unpaid bills, tickets, ect?”

I was referring to your American killin it at $14
An hour cash with not medical insurance

@one: how exactly does one "go after" Juan Jose Rodriguez, who speaks no English and has no ID , for those unpaid bills, tickets, ect?

I knew Puzder said something pro-immigrant. I just had to find it.

archive. org/web/20200304163307/htt ps://ww w.washingtonpost. com/national/low-skilled-immigrants-economic-burden-or-boon/2013/08/24/b1b88858-ed5b-11e2-9008-61e94a7ea20d_story.html

need to fix the space after archive, htt , ww and washingtonpost

Good read.

@One

"We were not discussing other levels. So it’s rather unfair (for the lack of a better term) to say we are missing them. If you want to say hey wait, how come H1B is not part of this conversation? That is more accurate than we are missing it :)"

Fair enough. I was adding to the 'greedy slaveowner comment.' :)

----

Now to add another thing that you guys may be missing in this conversation . . . people like me. I am the person that gets hired for automation projects. I let companies get rid of people and replace them with systems. I notice that the big talk is about farming. Ok, I have one client that offers software and hardware specifically for farmers. I am writing a lot of the software that goes into that shit to help automate everything. Everything from paying the workers (Paycards) to irrigation to (potential future project) integrating with the John Deere self driving machine (deere. com/en/autonomous/) to just in time ordering of boxes for packing, etc.

One thing that I think was missed in @2out's point was that he was talking about a summer job. As an employer, do I want to hire someone for 90 days then dump them when I can hire someone full-time?

I will bring this point up again. No, it was not in this thread, but one like this a bit ago.

Go to McDonald's. Look at who is taking and making your order. Do this during the day, the evening, the summer, etc. Chances are you will see very very very few 16 year olds if any.

Even though I think he is a COMPLETE DICK, and yes, I have met him (he had kids at the same school as my kid) is partially correct, Andy Pudzer. Pudzer is the CEO of Carls Jr. It used to be based here. He went on his rampage about CA and moved to TN and took the headquarters there. He didn't like how CA was more EMPLOYEE friendly than EMPLOYER friendly. Pudzer has tried to replace all humans at the restaurants. He has pushed to remove cashiers and food prep people. You can see McDonald's trying this approach on the ordering side. They are incentivizing people to use it instead of cashiers. This supports a couple of points. One, the jobs WE were able to get at 16 are not the same ones available to a 16 year old today. Two, automation is one of the reasons why. The desire to drive costs to zero to keep the prices cheap enough for consumers is a HUGE issue. We are our own problem. This is capitalism.

“Start working for $30 a day at 13 and retire At $30 per hour at 65”

How many of those $30 per hour jobs are there? Seriously. Is there enough to go around? I don’t know the answer to that.

If you have 100 $30 a day jobs as a 13 year old. Let’s just say 1/2 of them say fuck this I’m going to do something else. Even 3/4 of them. Are there 25 $30.00 jobs out there?

“And by law, the ED has to at least stabilize you. So... that's a factor”

And by law they can still go after you for payment. So… that’s a factor also.

I still think you guys are debating like this $14 per hour is for life.

Take a cpl of my past posts and combine them. The tomato picking through the starting factory to the career factory.

Start working for $30 a day at 13 and retire At $30 per hour at 65

“you had zero insurance or were paying Obamacare like I have been doing ?”

I was buying it off the exchange. I was paying $650 (????) a month. IIRC. And it was a high deductible.

Then I went an entire year without having insurance all together.

I now pay $66.00 for a high deductible.

Thinking about going to the more expensive plan? But that’s a whole other conversation.

Yes, I understand that. On the flip side, a large number of patients at the ED don't have insurance anyway. So, they ain't paying the bill. And by law, the ED has to at least stabilize you. So... that's a factor

@one, you had zero insurance or were paying Obamacare like I have been doing ?

“Not a big difference. Of course, the police officer is getting medical, W.C. benefits, retirement, ect... but, when you’re in the grocery store, cash in hand is what buys those tomatoes. Interesting...”

How many tomatoes are you buying if your $14.00 an hour is going towards paying off a medical bill if you don’t have insurance? Those extras are extremely important. How much you putting away for retirement if you’re barely surviving on $14 an hour?

It’s called a total compensation package. In the last ten years I had a couple of years I was paying my full medical insurance out of pocket. I actually decided to take a job making less in salary just to get my medical insurance paid. My “hourly rate” is lower. But my total compensation is higher.

It's kinda interesting to me. One says you "can't" make a living on $14.00/hr cash. Yet (and idk why this didn't dawn on me earlier) 4/7 agencies in my county pay $15.00 or less before taxes. Hell, the two highest paying agencies in the county pay less than $22/hr. So, strictly looking at cash in hand on payday. Not a big difference. Of course, the police officer is getting medical, W.C. benefits, retirement, ect... but, when your in the grocery store, cash in hand is what buys those tomatoes. Interesting...

“That's exactly who should be doing those shitty low paying jobs or adults using that as a second job. Not adults trying to make an actual living doing it.”

But that’s who’s doing them.

“Then of course we have the lovely child labor laws. What would be wrong about a field full of 12-16 year olds picking tomatoes 8 hrs a day for summer cash?”

Ok. I’m a teenager. I can lifeguard for $16.00 or pick tomatoes. Not a hard choice.

I can work the bag drop at the country club for $14.00 plus tips. Not a hard choice.

Now what is going to be the cost of your crushed tomatoes (I think that is the one you buy?) if the farmers are paying $14-16 an hour I have their crop picked.

“Certainly not saying that every job could be filled or denying that some jobs are just not fit for kids. But somehow over the years we as a nation have produced a generation that thinks they are owed a certain amount of pay performing a certain task. If they don't have that. They just don't work”

They’re working. You just can’t see it. First off you’re close to a baby boomer. You’re getting up there. When we were teens we had all the low paying beer money jobs each summer. What has happened to our population over the last 40 years? We’re not having the same amount kids as 50-75 years ago. Has the demand for the jobs decreased? Probably not. The work force has shrunk. Kids work. But they don’t have to have the shot jobs you and I had. They can work the jobs they want to. Poolside checking out the chicks or in the field sweating your nuts off bent over picking tomatoes? You decide.

@2out, "" What would be wrong about a field full of 12-16 year olds picking tomatoes 8 hrs a day for summer cash"".. absolutely nothing imo. That's exactly who should be doing those shitty low paying jobs or adults using that as a second job. Not adults trying to make an actual living doing it.