All things motor vehicles

Probably because I’ve only ever seen them in war zones lol.

"I would legit commit war crimes to get a newer Hilux."

I wouldn't commit war crimes but I would definitely buy one.

Reject modernity (EV)

Embrace tradition (Toyota Hilux)

I would legit commit war crimes to get a newer Hilux.

I believe teslas have that option actually

The biggest problem with EVs is the sound, or lack thereof. EVs should sound like the Jetsons flying car. It's a travesty that no one does it.

Skamp - Re: subsidies: While I agree renewables are the way to go, there is still a $7500 tax credit to purchase an EV. Not saying that is bad, but obviously ICE isn't the only thing being subsiized.

The worst part in all of this is that vehicles in general can be made to be much more servicable and likely relieable. Cost of batteries is coming down and getting better. Cost of solar equipment is coming down as well, but adding in labor costs can easily double the cost of installing solar, and having solar is the only way I'd consider getting an EV. The US seems to be in it's our own way when it comes to implementing solar.

Not sure about things out your way, but our electric costs have been rising mostly for the delivery, and the delivery costs are based on usage rather than being 100% fixed. Our supply costs seem to have been more stable recently and there are some options for different suppliers.

Mobil 1 in your bloodstream? Doesn't California have a Proposition 69 that requires you to have a label (tattoo?) that says:

"WARNING: I contain a product which is known to the State of California to cause cancer."?

Flip and I will continue to worship Our Lady of Internal Combustion.

I've got Mobil 1 in my bloodstream.

“Most people can't afford a new vehicle every 8 years. The average age of cars in the USA is something like 14 years.”

The average time Americans keep a new car is around 8 years. However, nearly two-thirds of Americans own their cars for five years or less, while the average age of cars and light trucks on the road in the US is 12.5 years.

The point isn’t that everyone should drive an EV, the point is that if you took away ff subsidies and saw the true cost of driving an ICE vehicle, more Americans would consider an EV.

Or hydrogen powered vehicles or a hybrid or some other renewable alternative.

~Scamp

“It's like solar, it's just not worth it.”

Portugal, Italy and Spain would disagree. They are all capable of powering their entire grid for days at a time with only renewable energy.

Once again, if you took away the ff subsidies and saw the real cost of powering our grid without renewables, you might have a different opinion.

~Scamp

Scamp - "...let’s not pretend that ICE vehicles are inherently cheaper,"

The point is, if you take away all of the fossil fuel subsidies, ICE vehicles would cost a lot more, gas would cost a lot more and there would be a bigger push for alternative, renewable sources.

The US is too much in the pocket of the ff industry. Other countries are way ahead in terms of renewable energy sources because their leadership isn’t bought and paid for by ff companies.

~Scamp

@8, "" I have a Japanese hybrid with Eco, Normal and Sport modes and only spend $30-35 per week in gas."". Wife had a hybrid like that. Was a great car and imo the best way to go. All electric doesn't pay. It's like solar, it's just not worth it

The biggest cost problem with EVs is the big purchase price for a new battery pack after 8-9 years. A bank/finance company isn't likely to spread the financing out for an additional maintenance purchase of $18k in 10 years. Especially since battery technology is likely to change radically in that time.

That's setting aside the utility of EVs in certain climates or for certain transportation needs.

"...there's nothing most people spend more money on than their cars."

There was a couple with a trunk load of toys at a party we attended who are definitely not most people.

I think there may have been another trunk full of batteries.

"We spend far more on bourbon than we spend on our cars..."

So did my dad. Probably why I don't drink.

Subaru in Houston offering “ 0 “ interest for 72 months on EVs

I wouldn't entertain the crazy idea of an all-electric car in the Midwest or North.

For me, that's an after I make the move to Houston, Charleston or Spain, Portugal or Italy type of purchase.

I saw the lines at the charging station in Chicago, and it reminded me of the cars lined up at gas stations in the 70's.

I have a Japanese hybrid with Eco, Normal and Sport modes and only spend $30-35 per week in gas.

“ Other than having children and buying a home there's nothing most people spend more money on than their cars.”

We spend far more on bourbon than we spend on our cars, although add in car insurance and the difference is far less.

Other than having children and buying a home there's nothing most people spend more money on than their cars.

Scamp - "...let’s not pretend that ICE vehicles are inherently cheaper,"

While I love the idea of EVs and especially energy indepence, there are few things I can think of on an ICE vehicle that would cost what some of these battery pack replacements would cost. That's a key deal breaker for anyone that buys used and holds onto their vehicles. Of course, vehicle manufacters could care less about "that" crowd.

As far as I can tell, this is almost purely a design issue. There is no reason why a battery pack can't be made to slide in/out and be easily serviced. I'm fairly convinced things are being designed for planned obsolence (ICE and EVs).

A lot of a car's content can be recycled, but a lot likely winds up in landfills due to this planned obsolence. Less people wrench their own vehicles these days, so I'd imagine even junk yards have felt this, especially when trying to charge more than half the cost of just buying a part new.

"The cost of routine maintenance is also lower and most people replace their vehicles every 8 years so battery replacement isn’t an issue for most."

Most people can't afford a new vehicle every 8 years. The average age of cars in the USA is something like 14 years.

My newest car is almost 19 and still cheap to keep.

The average American drives 37 miles per day with only about 1% who drive more than 100 miles per day so the EV market is still viable in the US. The cost of routine maintenance is also lower and most people replace their vehicles every 8 years so battery replacement isn’t an issue for most.

Renewable energy is still the future, the US is just stuck in the past because the fossil fuel industry holds so much power. No one wants to talk about the $20 billion in direct government subsidies and the estimated $650 billion in indirect subsidies (tax breaks, artificially low royalty rates for fossil fuel extraction on public lands, and the failure to account for the environmental and health costs of fossil fuel use), not to mention the cost of our military presence and operations around the globe, partly aimed at securing access to oil and gas resources.

Now, the current administration is trying to dismantle the EV infrastructure and eliminate subsidies for renewable energy which is designed to make us all even more dependent on fossil fuels.

If you are truly a “let the market decide” capitalist, you should be demanding that ALL government subsidies are eliminated. That would be disastrous, of course, as the price of ICE vehicles and gas prices would skyrocket but let’s not pretend that ICE vehicles are inherently cheaper, they just have a more powerful lobby in the US.

~Scamp

I understand that there's a significant difference in performance, number of recharge cycles, rate of capacity loss, the ability to accept full charges at various charging levels, etc., etc. among the various types of lithium batteries in EVs

I thought I heard that there are (were?) issues being able to fully charge the Rivian that claims a range of 420 miles compared to shorter range Rivians with a different battery chemistry. It has to do with the various types of chargers.

I dunno, I just put gas in my truck when the little indicator thingy is almost to the "You're Fucked" mark and I don't stop pumping until it's on the "Let's Go Cruising" mark. Then I'm good for about 400 miles (leaves me a few gallons in the tank so I don't overheat/burn out the fuel pump).

I really like the Rivian truck. I don't like the price for new, but that's a really nice looking truck and they get up to 420 miles. Plus we're looking at installing solar anyway, because sun is in abundance in Phoenix and it seems a shame to waste it.

I know someone who, after a long time on the wait list, finally got their Rivian.

A few months later he sold it because charging was a huge issue on their frequent long drives. I warned him that may be an issue before he got it, but...

...he sold it for more than what he paid for it AND he said he still got the EV tax credit.

He made out pretty good on that deal and he bought a GMC Yukon to replace the Rivian. Recently he got a recall notice on the Yukon. Apparently a major engine (6.2L) issue. So he wants to get rid of that but I'm not sure what he'll replace it with and what he can sell the Yukon for with the recall issue.