What Would You Do

@Destin

Here let me correct your words.

People like the two of you are the reason our nation has become the leaders of the free world.

Your loss...

Erotic, do you honestly believe that I would accept any advice from you or TBR? You two are the poster children for the Liberal/Progressive movement in our country. People like the two of you are the reason our nation is so fucked up.

comrade..you are such a hero...problem with you is you dotalk about yourself enough

@Destin

You keep speaking as an authority on the constitution. I like how TBR pointed that out. I also like how TBR pointed out that you should accept that you don't know it.

The constitution is not easily read to be understood. If so, there would be no need for SCOTUS to interpret it.

I strongly suggest that you go to the local community college and take some classes on US History. I doubt you could take a constitution class without getting into a 4000 level class.

As TBR mentioned, you like to ignore parts of the constitution. You know, the 'well regulated.' part. Or, excuse me, is that too obtuse and not clearly written?

@Destin , my friend was a crew chief on an F16 in the Thunderbirds for 2 years . He was career AF and to him it can’t happen ..Ok he is a little anal , but he says no experienced pilot will ever go up unless he has an experienced crew . Another friend of ours was also Airforce , he was a pilot on the big airplanes and later piloted for Continental and United . He said he flew into West Germany during the Cold War and you had to be really be trained . He said to train a combat pilot takes time . He said the Russians will bring inexperienced pilots right into the combat zone and the Ukrainians will lose lots of pilots . He said the Russians always used their equipment during the Cold War to try to get the US pilots cross into East Germany .

funfor2, If the pilot is already a fully qualified fighter pilot it would take approximately 6 months to a year to get him qualified in the aircraft. It would take years to master the aircraft and be able to effectively fight the aircraft air to air or air to ground. The knowledge I have of old Soviet Block aircrews is that they didn't get a lot of experience due to cost of flying hours.

When Poland was inducted into NATO I flew an ATC crew into a military field outside of Warsaw. The weather sucked. When we landed they were proud to show us their MIG 29s. I asked if we could get a ride. The Wing Commander who was a young guy said no because the weather was to bad. He told me that they could only fly in VFR conditions. I would bet that the Ukrainians are less proficient than the Poles so I wouldn't expect much from them. I am certain they can turn our F-16s in the yard darts without much training.

As for maintenance crews it can be even longer than for a crew member. Sure anyone can be taught how to take a part out and replace it with a new one, that doesn't take any skill at all. What takes skill is to analyze a problem, figure out what caused the problem and then decide the best course of action. The best maintainers I worked with in the Air Force were those guys that had 10 to 15 years experience. Even with that amount of time working the same aircraft they would get stumped.

In the end it is just another waste of our tax dollars to give the Ukrainians F-16 or any other form of help. The Ukrainians have lost the war before it even started but the Biden Regime is too busy getting lost and eating ice cream.

I'm not the one who pontificates on the Constitution without actually knowing anything about it.

The most important thing you will learn in life is how much you don't know.

Understanding that gives you a certain humility.

Another thing you know nothing about...

@Destin , you were a pilot. How long does it take to learn how to fly an F16 ? Also what kind of experienced ground crew to maintain the aircraft. ..The president has approved F16s to Ukraine and a friend ex Air Force says this can’t happen immediately without US pilots or experienced pilots and well trained ground crews. ..He thinks that Ukraine will ask for volunteers like mercenaries to fly these planes. What do you think ?

TBR, so you think you are a Constitutional scholar that knows everything. I guess you think you are another Obama. Didn't he say he was Constitutional scholar as well? We will never know because his college records have been sealed. Have yours been sealed as well?

I have been all over the world and saw what California is turning into. Keep drinking the kool aid as the cartels are pushing all of the illegal across the border. Your area is just the first stop of many while they work their way around murdering and raping. When it is happening to you and yours you will wish you had actually cared about the 2nd Amendment but it will be too late for you.

"Our Constitution was written and based on Individual Rights not the rights of the many."

Ah, the Constitutional scholar weighs in (wrongly) again.

Read the Preamble and try to tell me how it is not about the rights of the many. General Welfare, anyone?

"As so many on both sides forget and call us a Democracy. A Democracy is in my view point mob rule."

There are many forms of Democracy. A Constitutional Federal Republic is just one form.

"As a military member I didn't get to pick and chose what part of the Constitution I supported and defended even if I didn't like all of it."

It is obvious you don't like most of it. Th parts you don't like you pretend don't exist...

There is no question in my mind I would do whatever it takes to defend myself and family. I also would not lose any sleep over taking someone out that was looking to do the same to me or my loved ones.

erotic, you are a broken record on your gun control BS. Now it is to help cops. We have had the discussion many times about Constitutional Rights. Our Constitution was written and based on Individual Rights not the rights of the many. As so many on both sides forget and call us a Democracy. A Democracy is in my view point mob rule.

In a Constitutional Republic with individual rights if one person wants to exercise their rights they are able to no matter what the rest of the people want. If that person doesn't use their rights against someone else who cares? Obviously you and the rest of your Liberal Friends do. You will go as far as stacking the Supreme Court with Liberal Justices to get your own way.

I will always exercise my Constitutional Rights via the First and Second Amendment. It doesn't matter what the Suits and Robes in the nations capital or state capitals say. Our Founding Fathers wrote the Constitution and Bill of Rights in very clear and easy to read language. Only those on the Left want to change it. It is called Progressivism, which in my way of thinking is nothing more than Communism.

As a military member I didn't get to pick and chose what part of the Constitution I supported and defended even if I didn't like all of it. I did my job, my personal feelings didn't count for shit at that point. In the end any politician or judge that doesn't do their job via the Oath of Office they swore to should be considered domestic enemies and removed from office.

@Destin

"Do you ever wonder why so many military and law enforcement members swallow their own gun? Maybe they couldn't live with the memories and stresses of the job and the actions they were forced into taking by their own nation, state, county or city, basically society."

You are painting the results correct, but the actions incorrect.

NO ONE is compelled to join the military.

NO ONE is compelled to become a cop.

Those are choices. If someone choses to go into the military or become a cop, those actions are byproducts of that choice. This is why I have respect for those. They chose to go into an environment where nothing is good, everything is bad. Somehow, someway they need to be able to turn that off as soon as they 'clock out.' That is something that I feel confident in stating that I don't think I could do. That is also why I want to reallocate funds for the cops. That is also why I want the cops to not have to go full military because the citizens are better geared in weapons, ammo and armor than they are.

Yet, you want to keep your 2a and put those cops who chose to protect into harm. All for the love of a gun. That is pretty disheartening.

What a stupid binary choice that daddy has given.

Let's see . . .

He asks . . .

Will you fight back or will you take an ass whooping.

When I was 14 I had that situation. A 'bouncer' at the roller rink at 3am didn't like that my friend and I told them to fuck off after they kicked both of us out because they thought we broke into the Defender machine. Their justification? We were wearing black shirts. As I told management, look at every kid in here and point out the ones NOT wearing black shirts. There were 3 out of a couple hundred kids who were not wearing black t-shirts.

About a mile away from the rink, out of nowhere a car comes hauling ass and then slams on it's brakes next to us. Three big guys jump out, my friend and I RUN. My friend is zigging and zagging through cars and I am going straight. The fucker passed me :) About 1/2 mile of running and they seem to have just left. My friend is gone. I keep walking. Out of nowhere, a guy jumps me. He hits me with one punch and it knocks me down. He straddles me and starts wailing on me. I am 14, 5'11 and 190. He is 6'3 and 240. I remember what my mother had taught me. I spit in his face. His natural reaction was to wipe it off his face. As he stopped, I raised my right knee up as hard as I could into his nuts. He fell over, I got up and RAN. Two blocks away was the police station. Inside was my friend. He said, "What took you so long?" I said, I had to get my ass kicked. I filed charges against the guy who hit me. The cops caught him about 30 minutes later. He was arrested and from what I remember did a small amount of time for it.

Now, as the topic had morphed into killing someone. I love all the John Wayne, Dirty Harry keyboard warriors. It is easy as fuck to say what you would do on the internet. The reality is that you have no idea what you will do until you are put in that position. Destin is right, it is hard to kill someone for the sane amongst us.

"" In the end if some evil individual attempts to do harm to my family or friends then they need to be put down. if I am the one that does it so be it. I won't bat an eye and will have a beer after the piece of shit is neutralized."" .... That's probably most people tbh. I know it is for me. Just swap weed for beer after.

The question could you live with it? Is an interesting one. You need to ask the military member or law enforcement officer that has been put into that position. Even if the deceased individual was the enemy or a drug crazed lunatic you still think about it. It will always be with you. It was them or you or a friend or family member would have been the one taking a dirt nap.

Do you ever wonder why so many military and law enforcement members swallow their own gun? Maybe they couldn't live with the memories and stresses of the job and the actions they were forced into taking by their own nation, state, county or city, basically society.

As a retired military member I look at it as I did my job, kill the enemy. As I get older I realize that I have more respect for my past enemies than I do for some of those in my own nation. They were fighting for their own nation and way of life. Many of my fellow citizens would rather destroy our nation than to fight for it.

In the end if some evil individual attempts to do harm to my family or friends then they need to be put down. if I am the one that does it so be it. I won't bat an eye and will have a beer after the piece of shit is neutralized.

“ Could you kill someone and live with it, do you have a conscience? The people who don't have a conscience, those ones are the ones.”

Unfortunately I will live with it. I’m still here, they are not. Some people make it impossible for it not to be either him or I. I still think about that very real moment in slow motion at times. I would not knowing what I do today do anything different..

@Someone, I agree with you.

Could you kill someone and live with it, do you have a conscience? The people who don't have a conscience, those ones are the ones.

Its the real world in many WOKE cities.. we stopped visiting all WOKE cities and both carry and YES it happens. its not made up scenarios.. have handled 100's of those exact crimes over all my years in criminal justice.. so its real and happens every day , just watch the news !

People with head in sand.. think its made up !

daddy is a tool

A tool that need remedial fruit class. Apples and oranges daddy. Apples and oranges.

Troll.

"I go to Great lengths to avoid crazy people."

And yet, here you are in the Forum. Specifically, the Politics section of the Forum. Good luck with avoiding crazy here.

:-)

I go to Great lengths to avoid crazy people. Nothing like that has ever happened to me, nor is it likely to. I suppose if I found myself in a situation like that, like anyone else I would do my best.

Avoiding crazy people it's fairly easy. What I wonder is what sort of person makes up fantasy violence scenarios like this? Are you that scared?

"That's a bullshit question. Defending yourself is not being a vigilante"

Tell us how you reacted to your threats of being killed...uou made this comment to the group now expalin it or say it was a lie