Just Wondering

why molly blocked be

@onehell, no, he didn't. He appealed to their patriotism and sense of duty:

"As citizens, we each have a duty to put country above partisanship to defend our Constitution. That is why I will be casting my vote for Vice President Kamala Harris."

I'm not sure Dick Cheney has admirers outside of his family and friends, but he assuredly has conservative credibility. So does his daughter, who was rated among the more conservative members of Congress, one who voted with Trump 92.9% according to 538.

They are saying conservatism and a vote for Harris are not inconsistent.

There are people who won't make up their minds until election day. They are persuadable voters. Endorsements from conservative Republicans will likely help.

“Historically significant.”

Just not seeing it.

I wouldn’t give it that much significance.

Interesting, compelling, note worthy. All day long.

I can think of at least four political events in just the last 16 years with more significance.

“The percentage of MAGA folks within the party is maybe 20% of the voting public.”

As already stated. No one is changing the minds there.

“Conservatives like Dick Cheney can create a permission structure for other conservatives to swallow hard and vote for a Democrat.”

IMO, if someone is a fan of Dick Cheney and holds him in high regards amongst Conservatives. They already have decided to vote Harris or stay home period. I don’t think any are waiting for permission.

Again I didn’t read his entire press release. Did he appeal to people to not stay home and go vote for Harris?

"I really see this more as a rebuke of Trump than an endorsement of Harris."

Of course. That's my point.

Trump is so bad that the Darth Vader of old school Republicans is voting for the Democrat lady.

Historically significant.

"Do you think these people are undecided or will change the way they cast their vote?"

The percentage of MAGA folks within the party is maybe 20% of the voting public. Conservatives like Dick Cheney can create a permission structure for other conservatives to swallow hard and vote for a Democrat. Because, yeah, Trump's unfavorability rating is pretty high and some of that is a reflection of some Republicans and right leaning independents just being tired of him, his antics, and his craziness.

But they've spent decades in the right wing media ecosphere and are terrified that Democrats will bring the Marxism and wokeness.

Dick Cheney would not endorse a Marxist.

Abortion is also a wedge issue. Most Americans are not pro-forced birth, regardless of how they feel about abortion, but they might want some restrictions and he's saying it's a navigable issue.

Cheney's conservative credentials are unassailable. He's not a RINO or a squish or socially liberal.

You don't need to move a lot of Republican or right leaning independent votes, just some. Ten percent would be a game changer, but the Bannon Line for 2020 was only 3ish percent movement across party lines.

I wonder who has to suspend their beliefs to a higher level?

The Republicans who have believed and supported the narrative spoken by leaders of the Republican Party (Cheney) about the risks of having Democrats in control of the White House and potentially the House and Senate?

-OR-

The Democrats who have believed and supported the narrative spoken by leaders of the Democratic Party about Cheney, who prior to Orange Man Bad, was one person you could NEVER trust to give you the truth about anything?

** Weapons of Mass Destructions in Iraq?

**Support and Implementation of Enhanced Interrogation Techniques? Abu Ghraib ring any historical Cheney bells? LOL if you need a refresher spend a couple of hours watching Taxi to the Dark Side on Amazon Prime.

I wouldn't call Cheney's statement an "endorsement" of Harris.

He is voting for Harris for the same reason I would be - because the alternative is so abominable that he's willing to support someone with whom he has little in common.

“I think that there's a lot of "quiet Republicans", people who don't wear MAGA gear and don't fly Trump flags and don't post their political views on the internet, who will seriously consider what Cheney says.”

Do you think these people are undecided or will change the way they cast their vote?

I really see this more as a rebuke of Trump than an endorsement of Harris.

I think that there's a lot of "quiet Republicans", people who don't wear MAGA gear and don't fly Trump flags and don't post their political views on the internet, who will seriously consider what Cheney says.

And historically speaking... it is a huge deal for a guy with Cheney's conservative roots to vote for a Democrat.

“Anyone who has followed politics for any length of time knows that this endorsement is a huge deal.”

I honestly think that is an over statement. Is it a big deal? Kind of. Let’s face it. Cheney didn’t toss out the Republican Party all together, to never have anything to do with them again. He’s simply saying. This dude is dangerous. I can never vote for him.

Maybe I missed something he said or is going to do?

A lot of our friends here say they're Conservatives but seem more like they're right wing Populists.

Trump and MAGA/Cheney and Old time Conservatives.

Trading places

Trump is Billy Ray. Cheney is Mortimer Duke.

Bringing Trump MAGA into the folds of Conservatives is revolting to Cheney.

And bringing Trump into the fold has shown you cannot change the stripes on a zebra.

Anyone who has followed politics for any length of time knows that this endorsement is a huge deal.

@onehell, no I don't think any endorsement means anything. Zero. People have their minds made up imo

“But I would think there are many.”. Should read: But I would think there are not many

“Is there ANYONE who could come out with a statement like Dick Cheney's that would make the MAGA-ites reconsider their position?”

Absolutely not. I am willing to bet there is a decent percentage of MAGA-ites (greater than 10, less than 20) who do not even know who Dick Cheney is.

Jesus H. Christ himself could come down, show his face and endorse Harris. The MAGA-ites would be split down the middle between “It’s AI and that’s fake news”.

“Dick was absolutely hated by you loony lefts, now all of a sudden it's a great thing he endorses Kamala ?”

I wouldn’t classify it as “great”. I doubt the opinions of/and the person himself are changing with one single endorsement. But it is hard to not pay attention to the endorsement if you’re inclined to follow politics.

Will this endorsement push Harris over the top? I doubt it very highly. There is a small percentage of people still undecided. The majority of those people do not follow politics.

It’s like a person who doesn’t follow football all season. But come Super Bowl Sunday. They have an interest the game.

These people really don’t care who Dick Cheney is. And many may have never heard of him.

I suppose there may be a few fence sitting hard core Republicans still undecided. But I would think there are many.

“So Darth Vader's FUD statement without detail doesn't hold much weight for this voter.”

“In our nation’s 248-year history, there has never been an individual who is a greater threat to our republic than Donald Trump,” Cheney said in a statement. “He tried to steal the last election using lies and violence to keep himself in power after the voters had rejected him. He can never be trusted with power again.”

How much more “detail” do you need?

I didn't- and still don't- interpret your answer as "probably not", but - you've clarified now. Good enough for me.

VA---->I don't think you did. I didn't see an answer. Sample answers: "yes", and "no".

Your original question did not specify a yes or no response. And yes, there was an answer. The answer for the reasons I gave was probably not. If you'd like to go through each Republican that is now advocating voters switch their long-term affiliation from R to D for President, we can examine each one. However, the down ballot impact perspective will remain the same.

"but I'll take a shot at the core of your question"

I don't think you did. I didn't see an answer.

Sample answers: "yes", and "no".

Wtf makes you think I am a "loony left"?

Anyone who isn't MAGA = loony left, I guess.

VA---->Is there ANYONE who could come out with a statement like Dick Cheney's that would make the MAGA-ites reconsider their position?

I'm not sure how you are defining a MAGA-ites, but I'll take a shot at the core of your question. Probably not without questioning the statement authors background and motivation.

Let's take Darth Vader, he has been exclusively a Republican for his entire professional career (as I remember). One has to believe he has supported the Republican platform from the jump. What's changed? As I remember Donald Trump through the power of the Presidency did not remove any American's documented Constitutional Right. So Darth Vader's FUD statement without detail doesn't hold much weight for this voter.

Then you have to look at the total impact of Darth Vader's statement. By all of a sudden switching from supporting the Republican Candidate to the Democratic Candidate, what is the down ballot impact? Could Darth sway enough voters to give the Democrats the House and Senate majority? Sure, it's possible. What would be the impact of that on what he has (supposedly) believed his entire career as a Republican?

Dick was absolutely hated by you loony lefts, now all of a sudden it's a great thing he endorses Kamala ?