2nd impeachment

The whole thing was blown out the water today,

Mickey

Obviously everyone knew the craven cowards in the Republican party would vote along party lines before the trail started. That was pre-ordained. I totally agree though that this impeachment has to go forward, to lay down a bright red line that no President should cross, for historical reasons. There's also the principle of justice that there should be a price to pay for misdeeds, and being impeached twice is better than letting Trump get away scott-free. Presidential scholars are literally debating whether he ranks as the worst president ever, or the 2nd worst. We have learned that Hamilton and Madison were right over 200 years ago, when they said impeachment was a POLITICAL process, not a process of true justice, validating some of their genius.

As for me, I've 1000% lost all respect for the Republican party and what it stands for, which is basically nothing except for itself. The right call here is for both parties to condemn violence, and to call out Presidents who stoke that violence. The President should be the last person coming anywhere near calling for violence. He or she should be on the opposite end, calling for it to stop.

I do hope you people who still support Trump through this have now VALIDATED the right of people who want to use violent means to use FORCE to IMPOSE THEIR WILL on people, AGAINST THE WISHES OF THE MAJORITY OF THE PEOPLE. That's exactly what Marxist insurgents do in countries all across the world. By normalizing violence against our government, you've basically probably created the seeds of a future violent insurgency group that will rise up and use force the next time a super far-right Republican like Trump wins election as president.

They never had any chance if winning.

Everyone knew it from the get go.

Now you are just playing pigeon chess.

Nothing new with the left that’s for sure. They will do anything to smear Trump, 22 minutes of pain dropped on Democrats and the main stream media. , the look in CNN anchors faces is priceless!

All in all looks like the the democrats lost this FIGHT in another epic FAIL.

That was so sad they proved the Democrats cut and spliced Trumps speeches . What is wrong with them , is there that much hate with them.

Why are we talking about US steel...Trump hurt them badly, real badl

Democrat impeachment managers got their asses handed to them today ! Lol . The whole world is watching , I think Putin and the CCP are looking forward to walking all over this Democratic establishment.

Funfor2houston......you are correct. US steel is the best. It's a huge impact on that industry as well

@JC , if we don’t have the miners mining the coking coal .....We cannot build a lot of real steel .ie 4140 . Or steel used in military . We can get our tin all day long from China.

EA.......I agree things get fazed out and better things come along. I don't feel things should just abruptly end. I would like to see it done with definite plans and opportunities in place that can help these people. Yes my father made a very good living and had the best insurance of anybody anywhere. People losing those things are very difficult

EA......my opinion on abortion is mixed. I really don't ever care to see 1000's of people working at a facility like that and hope nobody else does. I am not going to compare the 2

EA......yes there Is clean coal. There are different types and grades. The coal here is low ash and sulfur content. The mine itself washes the coal before it goes to the facility for use. That makes it easier and cheaper for the facility buying it to treat it before they use it.

Democrat Stacy Plasket reveals election was stolen at the impeachment hearing .
Lol , classic clown show !

ER I am sure the moderator felt very sympathetic to your feelings. , I was never banned , lol .

--part 2--

This IS the coal miner job discussion. And btw, there is no such thing as clean coal. That is a marketing phrase just like safe sex, friendly fire and trickle-down economics.

Do I think that ANYONE wants to be a coal miner? Meh, maybe a very few. Do I think that people that live in that region want a job that they can get paid a decent wage? HELL YEAH. If they had a choice of a coal miner or something else that was similar do I think they would choose coal mining? Probably not.

See, to me, the coal mining job argument is akin to the argument that has been happening since man had paying jobs. Man invents ways to obsolete jobs and people bitch that the jobs go away and they want to preserve them. Last I checked, we don't have metalsmiths, blacksmiths, or horse-buggy makers, etc. Jobs become obsolete by other humans. The coal miners are no different. What is happening is they are fighting to live where they live and be able to afford to live there instead of going to where the jobs are. Which, if you think about it, is actually counter to what we promote as American ideals. Look at all the people who left from the east coast to settle the states west of the Mississippi. Those people were the 'pull them up by the bootstrap' people. They left where they felt they could not earn the living and went to earn it somewhere else. This is why it is ironic that the 'coal miners' are not willing to do the same.

I get it. It is VERY FUCKING HARD to leave where you have been for a bit. I am a 7th generation Floridian. My decision to move from Florida was VERY friggin hard. But, unlike the coal miners, I realized that my family's life would be better than where I was and took the 'risk.'

I have a friend who lives in some small town in Kentucky, near the Ohio border. We talk about his job opportunities. He has gone from working at the Dollar Store to Pizza Hut. Why? Because the area is so fucking small, that if you are a doctor, there is not enough business to support you. There is one CPA in town. I spent some time with him and got him going down the path to be employed by Intuit. He now gets to get a decent wage, live where he wants, and does bookkeeping for business' in Intuits Quickbooks program. I bring that up because again, it is the coal miner job. The demand for services and products exist. It just does not exist in that town. He had the choice of moving to where the demand is higher than the supply or be a hillbilly (appalachian style) and complain. I gave him a different solution.

@BONNIE

Yes, the thread got nuked. It was a very enlightening and interesting conversation with the moderators about it. I am not at liberty to disclose the conversation, but the responses I got, you'd think the moderators/owners are not into critical thinking.

@JC

It was acumen and collateral, you are correct. I started out by selling 30k devices. I got an order for it from Motorola. I talked to the manufacturer. They asked me to: refi my house, borrow against my car, borrow against my life insurance, borrow from family to cover the cost. I said, "I am 23. I live in an apartment with my girlfriend, have a leased car, am an only child from a poor upbringing on SS, and have no life insurance." I gave them a choice. I said, "I can have Motorola re-write the PO to you and you collect from them, when you collect you send me the spread or you are going to have to trust me that I will pay you. By the way, the terms with them are N30. We are now on day 16. So if you ship tomorrow, it will show up on their dock around day 24 of the terms and I should be paid in a week." They took the gamble. I called their credit department and said, "I got their check today and deposited it. I will get confirmation that it clears and wire you the money." They responded, "It's not due for another 20 days. You can send us a check, it's ok." I grew it from there. I wound up with a $1mm line of credit from a Fortune 100 company. They freaked out about my HUGE balls in dealing with them. They came out with a new product that I saw as a game-changer. It was a 10k product. At the time, I had a 50 or 100k line with them. I sent them a PO for 200 of them. That got the VP of sales and the credit department to go WTF! My cost was 8k. They saw a PO for almost 2mm from me (there were other items.) I get this call and are told that the initial run was 500 units. That there was NO WAY I was getting 40% of the product. I didn't have the line for it. They didn't want that many in one hand. We struck a deal. I kept the PO for 200 in, but was allowed to get 25 at launch and then 10 every 2 or 3 weeks after. I had to 'register' the product with them so that they knew who the customer was to verify that it was not in my inventory. When I sent them POs that I had gotten for 50 units before it launched from customers, they suddenly got a lot more faith in me. I wound up selling about 300 of those devices during its lifetime.

The credit line had some collateral in it. It was not 100% unsecured. There was 20% hard locked up capital that was assigned. These were bonds (corporate and government) that they had a claim to. There was a weird claim on made goods. When I said weird, it was because the claim only lasted on the make side. Once it was made and delivered, they lost claim. So yes, it was not 100%, and if I had to figure it out, it was probably somewhere in the 30% range that was ultimately secured, just in how cash flowed from that business.

Now back to the clinic.

Again, you are judging. If the clinic employed 1000 people getting $45+ an hour is that enough to justify it?

At what point on the line is there enough high priced jobs to justify it, or at what point on the line is there NOT enough to justify it?

Speaking of truth , the Democrat clowns are using info from the fake news as evidence in the impeachment , classic !

The world is laughing at them !

“Looks like someone got off their suspension and is trying to play catchup.“

I know one of your threads , where I proved you wrong was deleted. , I was never suspended. , I kind thing a libtard like you would complain !

Truth hurts doesn’t it !

Ea.... I do not doubt your business ability or money handling ability either. You definitely know more than I do.

EA......with 1k on hand then what did you have for collateral? It takes either or to get that kind of money plus having a good credit score

Ea.....an abortion Clinic is not going to have near the employees or produce more jobs through suppliers. Not a good comparison. You used the comparison to break off into another political view. Nice try.

My dad worked in a coal mine 25 years. Majority of that time spent on the long wall. If you don't know what a long wall is then look it up and see for yourself. He worked 2000 feet down and at times 5 miles back and was at all times threatened with an explosion because of methane. He was in good a shape from the first to last day. They minded clean coal.

Looks like someone got off their suspension and is trying to play catchup.

“Coal kills the workers and the inhabitants of the planet. Why would you support that job then.”

Eh just give them a mask or two , they would be ok .

Now back to the abortion clinic.

No, it is a good analogy. It was comparing high wage job to high wage job. It showed that you are not true in that you care about high wage jobs. It showed that you only care about jobs that YOU deem correct, and secondarily if it is high wage.

You judged the job and found it something you don't like. That is a moral call.

Ok . . . then when someone finds a job that creates health issues for others and wants it abolished, what is differrent? Coal kills the workers and the inhabitants of the planet. Why would you support that job then?

A very good comparison is the ACLU. They are guided by a principle and let that drive their actions. They believe in civil liberties. This is why they supported the Illinois Nazis. This is why they will adhere to their principle regardless of their moral beliefs.

Choose a big business.

I'd bet you a fuckton of money that more than likely it was NOT started by their capital.

It was started by a pseudo form of socialism capitalism hybrid. YOUR money in that bank was used to fund it. The lender calculated the risk of using YOUR money to lend it to someone else to collect a spread.

When I started my small company in Florida, I got it to 15mm a year in revenue. I had 1k when I started. How did I get it to 15mm a year? By financing it. I financed nearly 1mm in equipment and that caused a fun time when trying to buy a new house :)

When I ran the holding company here in CA, I had a 150mm line of credit at prime -1. That was used to fund orders and cover cash flow. It was also used to finance stupid and fun things :)

Now before you go off and start touting that I took a risk . . . I took no risk. Due to my business in FL, I have dealt with lots of companies and individuals in Brazil. Guess what it's like to be bankrupt as an individual in Brazil? Enjoy jail until you can pay the debt off. That is taking risks. Here, if I had to file BK, that's fine, the next day, I am still in my bed and I go on. Business BKs are rough there as well. So rough that Trump would not have survived. When I was running the holding company we opened a factory in Mexico. We were going to make for Nike. We did some orders and then shit just changed. We tried to sell the factory, no dice. We decided to close it. Try doing that in Mexico. It was cheaper and easier to just hand the keys over to the factory to the government than it was to pay out all the fines.

This is why I don't have much respect for people when they say they bootstrapped themselves and created this behemoth. Chances are they didn't.

Yes, even though in my life, the majority of the time, I have had a C-level job, I am extremely pro-labor. I am well aware of what they do, which makes me look good. I have serious issues with the massive disparity in pay between the two. Sure, a janitor should not be making what the CEO makes. A janitor should not make as much as a middle manager. I am for a much flatter disparity. I am also for a performance-based pay package. When I was running the holding company, I had a base salary that was 120% of my assistant. Yes, I earned 20% more than she did. That was my base. I had quarterly goals that had a 90% chance of hitting if I did not slack off. Every year during reviews, I had a target operating company that I had to get from A to B. I also had to keep the other operating companies at a certain level. That was a huge bonus if I hit it. It was tiered that if I can in at 90% of goal, I got 50% of the bonus. Below I got zero. I also had another bonus that was tied to the holding company targets. That was always a crapshoot because you can try and predict the future, but 9/11 can happen and all bets are off. If I hit all 3 of those bonuses, yeah, I was earning 10+ times that of my assistant. This is why I am not too irked with Bezo's or Musk's pay package. Musks is tied to the stock price, so if it goes up, he gets a percentage of that increase in shareholder value.